Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, RISE)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The people of Tallaght are up in arms about the plan to close the post office in the Square, Tallaght, to privatise it and to reopen a smaller post office with fewer services in a different location. Almost 2,000 people have signed a petition that was delivered to the GPO last week, where An Post informed the campaigners that it intends to proceed.

I have been doing a lot of work on this and have been speaking with a lot of people. I have not come across a single person who has anything bad to say about the staff in the post office, who provide an outstanding service. It is not just a matter of the basic bread and butter of a post office; it is a real community service for people. Tallaght is not the only location that is on the chopping block of this privatisation agenda. Rathmines, Phibsborough, New Ross, Roscommon and Tipperary are in a similar situation.

I can predict, because I am a mind reader, what the Minister of State will say in response. As well as being a mind reader, I also have a letter from the Minister for the environment, which states that An Post indicated that the change in business model of the six offices will not in any way change the range or extent of services offered. That is just not accurate. That might be what An Post is telling the Minister, but it is not even really what An Post is telling me.

I got a similar commitment from An Post. I wrote back to it to ask if it could confirm the number of staff working in the new post office in Tallaght will not be reduced from the current number and if it could confirm that the number of physical counters will not be reduced. I received information back, which stated:

We will almost certainly be moving, but staff and counters are normally pitched to the numbers coming in the doors. Post offices often have extra counters that are never used in practice.

It stated that it has no plan to do anything other than to have a top-notch facility. In other words, there was no guarantee that the same number of staff will remain. There was no guarantee the same number of counters would remain. In reality, what will happen is that there will be a reduction in the number of staff and a reduction in the number of counters.

We know that these contractor-led post offices often do not provide the same level of service. Currently, people are often directed to the post office in the Square, Tallaght, to get the full range of services, for example, to get prize bonds, etc., because the privately operated post offices can effectively opt out of them. I just do not see how in the real world having fewer staff and counters is a guarantee to provide the same service.

The workers are being treated abysmally. Again, I have correspondence with An Post about this. The workers are not being given the option to transfer over to the contractor operation. The workers are not being given the option of voluntary redundancy. They are being given no option whatsoever. They are going to be transferred elsewhere within An Post in Dublin. They will probably have to go from a situation where they live and work in Tallaght to a situation where they will have a one-hour commute into and out of town every single day.

That is not even the worst of it. Once the post office is no longer directly run by An Post, as is the case with the majority of post offices across the country, there will be no guarantee that it will stay at all. Over the past three or four years, approximately 200 post offices, which were all contractor-run post offices, have been closed down across the country. This is not something that is just happening in rural areas, although it should not be happening in rural areas. It is also happening elsewhere in Dublin South-West. In Templeogue and Rathfarnham, post offices have closed. In one circumstance, this was because the shop it was in closed. In another circumstance, it was because the postmaster died. No one has replaced them and An Post has said this has nothing to do with it because this is a contractor-led operation.

This is a two-stage process. Step one is having smaller or fewer services, which is bad for the workers. Step two is when the post office goes entirely. This plan should be withdrawn and the Government should put pressure on An Post to do so.

Mary Butler (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I thank the Deputy for raising this really important issue and I welcome the opportunity to outline the position on the matter on behalf of the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan and the Minister of State, Deputy Chambers. Both the Minister and the Minister of State are aware of the impact that decisions relating to changes in An Post operations have on communities and individuals, in both rural and urban areas.

An Post is a commercial State company with a mandate to act commercially and, as such, day-to-day operational matters, including decisions in relation to the size, distribution and future of the network are matters for the board and the management of the company, not ones in which either the Minister or Minister of State have a statutory function.

The Minister has responsibility for the postal sector, including the governance oversight of An Post, to ensure the company is compliant with the code of practice for the governance of State bodies and the governance functions included in the statutory framework underpinning An Post. In line with its ongoing transformation, as the Deputy has said, An Post has announced that it is converting six post offices from An Post-operated to contractor-operated, one of which being the Tallaght office. That post office will join the mainstream of national post offices, in that more than 90% of the country’s 900 post offices are operated by contractors. It should be noted that fewer than 40 post offices throughout the State are now run directly by An Post. I have the same correspondence the Deputy has, which states that An Post has indicated that the change in business model of the six offices will not in any way alter the range or extent of the services offered by An Post in those locations. I think those are the words the Deputy read out.

An Post has, over the last number of years, been transforming its business by delivering new products and new formats in the way it operates. This includes, among other things, diversifying and growing the financial services products it provides for individuals and small- and medium-sized enterprises, to include loans, credit cards, more foreign exchange products, local banking in association with the major banks and a full range of State savings products. An Post is providing agency banking services for AIB and Bank of Ireland across its network of post offices.

The Government agreed that an amount of €10 million per annum will be provided by the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications - this is what the Government is doing to support post offices - over a three-year fixed term to support the postmasters, with funding to be dispersed across the post office network. The funding is being paid monthly for each 12-month period. More than €12.2 million has been claimed by An Post to the end of March 2024 for the postmaster network.

The programme for Government recognises that a modernised post office network will provide a better range of financial services and e-commerce services for citizens and enterprise, as part of our commitment to a sustainable nationwide post office network. The overall €30 million in funding that is being provided to support a sustainable, nationwide post office network is in line with this commitment.

I am answering this on behalf of the Minister, but I will make a comment under my own brief as the Minister of State with responsibility for older people. We lost the post office in An Rinn, the Gaeltacht area of Waterford last week. We did have somebody who was prepared to take it on but unfortunately, it just was not financially viable. Many older people use the post office every week-----

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, RISE)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Yes.

Mary Butler (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

-----and it is what they have always done. Losing a post office in a local community is very distressing. Money claimed locally is spent locally. Maybe in 30 or 40-years’ time that whole generation will have passed on and post offices will not be as important. Yet, as Minister of State with responsibility for older people, I can understand how important post offices are to the local community. I am saying that on a personal level.

Paul Murphy (Dublin South West, RISE)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I agree entirely. A very high proportion of those who are signing the petition or who are getting involved in the campaign are older people. It is a community focal point for many people who go to the post office on a weekly basis to get their bits and pieces done, and to meet and chat with people. Again, everyone speaks so highly of those workers, who are now being put in a very difficult situation.

As I predicted, the Minister of State read out a sentence about how An Post has indicated that nothing will change in terms of the service model.

Again, I say to the Minister of State and the Minister, who will hopefully read the transcript, that I have the email correspondence from An Post which clearly states that it is not committing to keeping the same number of staff or the same number of counters. In what world does that amount to a guarantee that the same services are going to be provided to the community?

What is happening is that there is a long-term agenda to significantly reduce the number of An Post branches throughout the country. As long as they are directly run by it, which 10% are, An Post cannot politically do that because it is very difficult to shut down a post office. There will be a community response based around older people and others who use post offices and An Post will be forced back. There is a two-stage process. First, An Post washes its hands of the post office and tells people not to worry. It states that everything will be the same and that the post office will be run by a contractor. Second, either An Post says the post office is no longer financially viable -that is definitely not the case when it comes to Tallaght because it must be one of the busiest post offices in the country - the postmaster dies or something else happens. I have also seen this in the context of Rathfarnham. The Government says that all of this has nothing to do with it.

This is about running down our national network of post office branches. We should be opposing it and the Government should be opposing it. An Post should withdraw this proposal. Exactly the same points could be made about Rathmines, Phibsborough, New Ross, Tipperary and Roscommon, given that the same sort of campaigns have been run there and the same issues exist. I appeal to An Post, even at this late stage, to withdraw the plan.

Mary Butler (Waterford, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The Deputy will appreciate that the Minister cannot intervene in matters which the Oireachtas has given An Post a statutory responsibility to fulfil. An Post has an independent board that has a clear mandate. I accept that the Deputy is not happy that the post office is being converted. However, I am thankful that it is not proposed that the post office be closed.

I encourage everyone to use the post office. I say that every time I have an opportunity to speak on this issue. It is not only in rural areas, it is also in urban areas. Post offices depend on over-the-counter transactions. Given the increase in the number of online transactions, however, it is very important that people continue to support post offices. The Deputy said the Tallaght post office is extremely busy, but that is not always the case. I ask people to continue to support post offices.

I will bring the Deputy’s concerns back to the Minister and his officials in person. The Deputy referred to a petition with over 2,000 signatories, the majority of whom are older people who are used to the post office as it currently operates.