Dáil debates

Wednesday, 18 October 2023

Ceisteanna - Questions

Cabinet Committees

1:10 pm

Photo of Bernard DurkanBernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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14. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on economy and investment will next meet. [41576/23]

Photo of Cathal CroweCathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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15. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on economy and investment will meet next. [42582/23]

Photo of Michael MoynihanMichael Moynihan (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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16. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on economy and investment will meet next. [42586/23]

Photo of Alan DillonAlan Dillon (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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17. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on economy and investment is next due to meet. [42614/23]

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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18. To ask the Taoiseach when the committee on economy and investment will next meet. [42349/23]

Photo of Paul MurphyPaul Murphy (Dublin South West, RISE)
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19. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on economy and investment will next meet. [42352/23]

Photo of Cian O'CallaghanCian O'Callaghan (Dublin Bay North, Social Democrats)
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20. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on economy and investment will next meet. [42510/23]

Photo of Ruairi Ó MurchúRuairi Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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21. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on economy and investment will next meet. [43574/23]

Photo of Niamh SmythNiamh Smyth (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail)
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22. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet Committee on Economy and Investment will meet next. [42877/23]

Photo of Mick BarryMick Barry (Cork North Central, Solidarity)
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23. To ask the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on economy and investment will next meet. [44963/23]

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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I propose to take Questions Nos. 14 to 23, inclusive, together.

The Cabinet committee on the economy and investment was re-established in January 2023 and last met on 25 May. The next meeting of the committee is scheduled for 16 November. The committee has a function similar to that of the committee on economic recovery and investment, which met six times in the course of 2022 and is chaired by the Tánaiste. Membership of the committee comprises the Taoiseach, the Tánaiste, the Minister for Environment, Climate and Communications, who is also the Minister for Transport; the Minister for Finance, the Minister for Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform, the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, and the Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media. Other Ministers or Ministers of State will be invited to participate as required, as is the case with officials and advisers.

The committee oversees the implementation of programme for Government commitments aimed at a sustainable economic recovery, investment and job creation, including through the implementation of our national digital strategy, Harnessing Digital: the Digital Ireland Framework. As with all policy areas, economic issues are regularly discussed at full Government meetings, where all formal decisions are made.

We continue to see good economic performance. More people are at work than ever before. Youth unemployment is close to an all-time low and female participation is close to an all-time high. Our economic model is founded on well-established and successful pro-enterprise policies, providing a sustainable regulatory and tax environment, with sound management of the public finances and significant investment in the infrastructure and skills required to ensure our ongoing competitiveness. The recently announced budget 2024 firmly continues this approach, with additional measures for business including the €250 million increased cost of business scheme, ICOB; additional funding for the IDA and for the local enterprise offices, LEOs, to assist small businesses; improvements to the research and development tax credit; and a new angel investment scheme.

1:20 pm

Photo of Alan DillonAlan Dillon (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I want to raise the issue of continued investment in water services. I acknowledge we are experiencing significant reform, with the aim of better services and promoting wider environmental protection, but there remain significant infrastructure deficits that need to be addressed, even after Uisce Éireann focuses on its capital programme in 2023. One specific project is the Newport sewerage scheme in Clew Bay in west Mayo, which has a timeline that has been pushed out to 2026, resulting in raw sewage being introduced to the waterways around Clew Bay. I appreciate the Government's commitment to high-level investment in this sector but we have timelines that are just unacceptable.

Within the rural water programme, we still await the next publication of the multi-annual rural water scheme. I would appreciate some clarity in this regard. When will it be published? We have various villages in north Mayo, including Srahataggle, Portacloy and Porturlin, to name a few, that are reliant on a new water connection. These households do not have a domestic water supply and when it rains heavily, they have condemned wells, their heating systems do not work and they cannot have showers. It is dreadful that in this day and age they are subjected to these conditions. I ask again about the overall programme for continued investment in water services, especially into the rural water programme. I would appreciate the Taoiseach's feedback on this.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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The Taoiseach often says there are no instant solutions to the housing crisis but I wish to suggest something the Government could do that could make a dramatic and rapid impact on it. I attended an ICTU conference on housing the other day where one of the other speakers was from Vienna. She pointed out that in Vienna now, 60% of all new developments are required to be social or affordable housing. Imagine that; not 10% but 60%. When some developers kicked up, the local authorities told them that if they kicked up any more they would make it 80%. Some 60% of Vienna's residents live in subsidised housing. How does that apply here? We have a lot of housing going on and only 10% goes to social housing. Soon, but not now, 10% will go to affordable housing but huge numbers of people who are not eligible for social housing cannot afford the rents or house prices of the new developments, so they are being bought up by vulture funds and so on. What I am proposing is that we take a leaf out of the Vienna book and use the big budget surpluses the Government has for capital investment to buy a significantly higher proportion of the newly developed housing for both social and cost-rental housing, that is, for the people over the thresholds who are completely priced out of the housing market. That can be done, it should be done and it could be done relatively quickly. It would make a dramatic impact on the availability of affordable housing for those affected by the housing crisis.

Photo of Paul MurphyPaul Murphy (Dublin South West, RISE)
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EirGrid admitted this week that there is a reasonable probability that energy supply will not meet demand this winter. The main reason for that is the proliferation of data centres, consuming 18% of our electricity and projected to consume 30% of our electricity by 2030. This uncontrolled growth is incompatible with the need to reduce carbon emissions to zero to halt climate catastrophe. Rather than tackling the root of the problem by banning the construction of more data centres, EirGrid's solution is to construct a liquefied natural gas, LNG, terminal or multiple LNG terminals. Supposedly this is to serve as a back-up when the insatiable demand of data centres for electricity overwhelms the normal capacity of the grid. The CEO of EirGrid stated on Monday that building an LNG terminal is an urgent matter for the State. Environmental activists in this country have fought against LNG terminals for years. Only last month they celebrated An Bord Pleanála's correct decision to refuse planning permission for a facility in Shannon and hoped that this was the last we would see of this failed approach. However, now it seems the Government is about to exhume that dead horse in the service of the big tech multinationals. Will the Taoiseach confirm or deny that LNG infrastructure is to be endorsed in the forthcoming energy policy?

Photo of Cian O'CallaghanCian O'Callaghan (Dublin Bay North, Social Democrats)
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I want to ask the Taoiseach about recent analysis on housing affordability and how this impacts on the economy and investment. According to analysis published by the Parliamentary Budget Office recently, since Fine Gael has taken office house prices have increased by 76% and rents have increased by 90%, while wages have increased by only 27%. Since the Taoiseach entered the Government, housing has become less and less affordable and homelessness has reached its highest ever level, with record numbers of children growing up without a home. The numbers of people in their 20s, 30s and 40s still living in their childhood bedrooms is at record levels and home ownership levels are at their lowest for more than 50 years. Does the Taoiseach accept that the Government's approach on housing is simply not working?

Photo of Ruairi Ó MurchúRuairi Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I have brought up the issue of the recommendations of the Committee on Budgetary Oversight before, and Deputy Boyd Barrett might also have mentioned it once or twice. In fairness, the Taoiseach has been supportive of those recommendations and a stakeholders' forum. Follow-up will need to happen with the Minister and this is vital. There is much talk of the possibility of cross-Border solutions with film studios and such, and that is all welcome, but we need to get those pieces and issues like the possibility of blackballing dealt with.

My question is on the tax credit in computer gaming. Nexus, Ireland's first gaming conference, is happening today. The idea of this tax credit was that there was not a sufficient computer gaming industry in this State. How have things progressed and what are the predictions for the future? It is a huge industry and a considerable amount of people take great enjoyment out of it.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Dillon's question was on Uisce Éireann and he particularly raised the slow timeline for the Newport sewerage scheme. That is something I will make personal inquiries about. I have met Uisce Éireann about its work programme and it has been clear with me that it is not possible for it to progress all projects at any one time. Even with additional finance there are limitations around skills and supply chains. There has to be a pipeline and the pipeline is not as fast as any of us would wish it to be.

On rural water schemes for villages, I am keen to make progress on this in order that we can have water schemes in more villages and small settlements. In that way, the small villages can have a natural increase and people can build houses in them. The Minister, Deputy Darragh O'Brien, tells me that a decision on that will be made in the coming weeks, and certainly no later than the end of the year.

Going back to the question the Deputy asked in the last segment, on the chief pharmacy officer, I will have to double check with the Minister, Deputy Stephen Donnelly, about that. The last time I checked the thinking was not to have an individual chief officer for all professions, including pharmacy, speech and language therapy and physiotherapy. I could go on and describe more but the thinking was to have a single one for all of the allied professions. That was the thinking on that but that may have changed. We have a Government-funded National Centre for Pharmacoeconomics, headed by Professor Barry, which does a lot of the work a chief pharmacy officer might do in a different jurisdiction.

Deputy Boyd Barrett talked about Vienna and mentioned the fact that 60% of all new developments in Vienna are reserved for social and public housing. It would be interesting to know where we are with that in the Dublin City Council area, because a huge amount of the new housing that is being built in the Dublin City Council area is social, cost rental or affordable. It might be the case that even without a rule it is at 60% already. Not a huge number of private homes for purchase are being built in the Dublin City Council area but it would be worth checking that out. If you look at the 30,000 new homes that were built last year, the proportion of those that were private homes for sale on the normal market was quite small. It could have been as few as one third, and most of those were located around our cities and suburban areas. I would like to see more homes being built for private purchase by people in all parts of the country, including Dublin city.

Photo of Richard Boyd BarrettRichard Boyd Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, People Before Profit Alliance)
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The big investors are buying a lot of them.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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Deputy Paul Murphy asked about electricity supply. I am glad to say we are in a much better place in the security of electricity supply than we were this time last year. That is down to the extra generation taking place, in both renewable and gas, and the fact that there is a better partnership between EirGrid and the big energy users, including data centres. Data centres can be called on to contribute to the grid because they have generation capacity of their own, particularly when there are issues around supply.

It is rarely part of the debate that data centres can produce their own energy and contribute to the grid and thereby help to solve the problem if there is shortage of supply. We are assured there will not be any red alerts this winter and it is unlikely there will be amber alerts either.

LNG infrastructure is not about data centres but is about the issue of gas supply. We in Ireland are going to need natural gas until at least 2050, if not beyond then. Even if we achieve net zero, we will still use natural gas to a certain extent. We currently only have two ways to get gas onto the island, which are through the UK interconnector and the Corrib gas field. When the Corrib gas field runs out, there will be only one way to get gas onto the island and that is a security risk. We need to do something about that. A number of options are available and we have not made a decision on that yet. Those options include floating LNG, fixed LNG and additional interconnectors to jurisdictions other than the UK.

I heard what Deputy Cian O'Callaghan had to say. It was another example of the selective use of statistics, which we are all guilty of sometimes. He specifically mentioned the ratio of earnings to average house prices and picked 2011 as the base year. If he picked 2007 or 2008 as the base year, he would come to a different conclusion. I encourage him to do the maths in that regard. I will use statistics selectively in respect of people earning their own homes. If Deputy O'Callaghan can do it, so can I. The number of people in Ireland who own their own homes is at a record high of 1.2 million. We know that from the census.

1:30 pm

Photo of Cian O'CallaghanCian O'Callaghan (Dublin Bay North, Social Democrats)
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It is the lowest percentage for 50 years.

Photo of Leo VaradkarLeo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael)
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In percentage terms, the rate has fallen but is still at 69%, when one excludes those are who are not stated. That is pretty high by international standards but not high enough. That is why we are prioritising home ownership.

I will have to come back to Deputy Ó Murchú on his question in respect of gaming. I might ask the Minister for Finance, Deputy Michael McGrath, to come back to him. I know the tax credit is designed to encourage more of the gaming industry to base operations here in Ireland and we are seeing signs of that already.