Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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The next Topical Issue matter is the ongoing strike action by medical scientists.

Pa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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It may not be an ongoing strike anymore, but in any event it is hard to think of a more blatant example of unfair and unjustifiable work practices and workplace situations that exists in our hospitals. Qualified scientists who worked through Covid, dealt with the cyberattack and accepted extra work are paid 8% less than colleagues who did the same work and who sit by side with them in the lab. Some earn less than those they supervise and others' wages decrease if they qualify. Whatever about pay, many hospitals, like University Hospital Kerry, have introduced compulsory on-site rosters on-call. This in effect is mandatory overtime.

Staff must work obligatory overtime of 12 to 36 hours extra per week. Many staff at the hospital in Crumlin work 24 hours of extra overtime. In Kerry, the Monday to Friday staff must work the daytime as well as the night which means, in effect, a 20-hour shift, and from 8 p.m. they are on their own covering two departments and they get no proper break. On Saturdays, Sundays and bank holidays in Kerry, there used to be a 24-hour shift but that changed last year to a 12-hour shift so staff are working on twice as many weekends.

I spoke to one scientist who has worked for 30 years and never had a strike day. In fact, I understand that the last industrial action was 50 years ago. Medical scientists have waited decades for this pay inequality to be resolved because clearly their pay and working conditions are not fair or reasonable. As a result, as the Minister of State may know, an increasing number of staff have become unwell due to burnout and are leaving. When trainees are about to qualify, they see the work pressure that staff must undergo. As a result, pharmaceutical companies are mopping up newly qualified staff. Whatever about the history of what has gone on - the expert group's recommendation for restored pay and for pay levels to be the same as the biochemists was accepted by the Minister for Health and Children at the time, who is now the Taoiseach - and whatever about benchmarking and procedural errors, I know that exploratory talks have begun or are due to begin today but I believe the Government must intervene and the HSE must engage properly. The Department of Public Expenditure and Reform must be involved. The HSE must enter meaningful discussions, provide a timeline and not look over its shoulder at any other workplace situations. The Government must resolve this inequality and the two-tier pay system that continues to exist.

Anne Rabbitte (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy for raising this issue, which I am taking on behalf of the Minister for Health.

Firstly, I wish to acknowledge and pay tribute to the dedication, professionalism and commitment of all medical scientists throughout the country. As the Deputy has quite rightly said, medical scientists play a valued and vital role within our health service. They worked tirelessly during the pandemic. Their efforts in testing Covid-19 samples were and remain very significant. It was not just during Covid that they have worked tirelessly. They work tirelessly at other times, as the Deputy has outlined. The Government recognises the extraordinary contribution made by those working in our health services, which is evidenced by the decision taken earlier this year to provide a pandemic bonus payment.

I am fully aware of the ongoing and long-standing claim for pay parity between medical scientists and clinical biochemists. Health management has been engaging with the Medical Laboratory Scientists Association, MLSA, on these issues at the Workplace Relations Commission, WRC, under the terms of the current public service agreement, Building Momentum. As the MLSA is part of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions, the association is bound by the terms of the agreement for the remainder of its lifetime.

Building Momentum includes the process of sectoral bargaining to deal with all outstanding claims across the public sector. The bargaining fund equates to 1% of basic pensionable pay for each bargaining unit set up under the agreement. The MLSA requested, and was facilitated, with its own bargaining unit in the sectoral bargaining process in order to progress its claim for parity. As such, the MLSA has at its disposal a fund equivalent to 1% of basic pay of all medical scientists. While this fund is insufficient to resolve its long-standing claims, it can partially resolve them and the remainder could be addressed in a future public service agreement as per the terms of Building Momentum.

As I have previously stated, the MLSA and health management have been engaged in talks over the last number of months with the aim of finding a way to advance the claim through the sectoral bargaining process. Several options were explored during these talks but to date but none have satisfactorily resolved the claim within the terms set out under Building Momentum. As this matter could not be resolved, it has been referred to the Public Sector Agreement Group, PSAG, which is the dispute resolution mechanism that was set up under Building Momentum, twice since January. At the latest meeting on 11 May, the PSAG recommended that the matter be immediately referred to the WRC and that industrial peace be maintained in the meantime. Health management met the MLSA under the auspices of the WRC on 17 May but, unfortunately, no resolution was reached.

The parties have accepted an invitation from the Labour Court today for an exploratory engagement in order that the court might establish whether, and how, it might assist the parties in finding a resolution to the matters in dispute. I welcome the decision by the MLSA to lift its strike action to attend this Labour Court engagement. The Government recognises that all of the State’s industrial relations machinery should be utilised to resolve the matter. As the Deputy has clearly said, all parties need to be at the table to find a mechanism that will prevent further strike action.

Pa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein)
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The Minister of State has said that health management has engaged with the association. I am not sure it has engaged in a meaningful way because the offer of 1% is neither here nor there nor going to the creamery. I have spoken to a scientist who feels that the training of new graduates is soul-destroying because she does her best to bring them up to speed, but when most graduates are exposed to the full workload, they choose not to work in the public system and are lost to private industry. As the pharmaceutical industry is booming at the moment, it has the resources to offer better pay and conditions. That is all the more reason for the medical scientist issue to be ironed out as soon as possible. As part of the graduate work, those who choose to work as laboratory aids are not required to be qualified. When they see that they will receive a pay cut, they are scared off to a large extent. Even though one of the people to whom I spoke is close to retirement, she now works more hours than she has ever done. That is a significant problem because there are staff shortages in the laboratory. There is no immediate prospect of any of those vacancies being filled, which is no wonder because all of the graduates are choosing not to enter the public system. That situation is in addition to what has happened over the last few years.

The Minister of State has paid tribute to the work that medical scientists carried out during Covid and the cyberattack. I accept that they have received a bonus payment. Let us not go down that road again because there are people working side by side and some of them are not getting it either. Something must be done about this issue. One cannot be looking over one's shoulder. The current situation is clearly inexcusable, unjustifiable and unequal. Again, the representative body has decided to enter exploratory talks. I hope meaningful negotiations can take place during those talks.

Anne Rabbitte (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Deputy again for raising this issue. I welcome the fact that there is a meeting today and that all sides have decided to participate.

I do not know whether the Deputy listened to RTÉ Radio One yesterday morning when Tony Canavan, the CEO of the Saolta Hospital Group, was interviewed. He gave a fantastic interview that clearly explained the work done by medical science laboratory practitioners in all of the hospitals. I say to anybody who thinks that their role just concerns patients within hospitals that they play an integral part in our health services. Not only do they do essential work for hospitals, but they also do essential work for GPs who need tests done on blood samples and so the impact of their work spreads right into the community. Yesterday, the CEO talked about the Saolta group, which concerns the area where the Leas-Cheann Comhairle, myself and our constituents live. He said that 400,000 procedures would have to be halted as a result of one day's strike. Therefore, we cannot afford not to have negotiations. The Deputy is right that we clearly need representatives of the HSE, the MLSA and the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform at the negotiating table. I welcome the intervention and I am glad they are meeting now. However, meaningful negotiations must take place to prevent a repeat of what happened over the last two days.