Jen Cummins (Dublin South Central, Social Democrats)

I welcome the Sinn Féin Bill and thank that party's Members for their work on it. The use of school uniforms is often debated by parents, patrons and researchers. Some people love uniforms and others do not.

The Social Democrats support this Bill, however, if the Ceann Comhairle will indulge me, I will speak about having school uniforms in the first place. I will not take up too much time on this but Ireland is one of only three countries in Europe that has uniforms in our State schools. The other countries are the UK and Azerbaijan. Other countries may have school uniforms and it varies depending on whether they are private schools or there are particular reasons but most do not in their state schools.

I researched this issue during my doctoral work and when I worked as a youth worker and in a school completion programme. Uniforms are a huge cause of discomfort for people. The main reasons are that for children and young people with sensory issues, uniforms are often very uncomfortable and are very itchy. They are not practical for girls, in that uniforms might have very long or very short skirts and are not very practical in cold weather and for cycling. However, that is not a reason that if we do have a school uniform that it is not then affordable. I will come to that part and I am not dissing this Sinn Féin Bill at all. I am just saying that uniforms are important for people and if we have them, that is fine but there might be an alternative.

Uniforms cause a huge amount of difficulty for some students because they forget items. The Bill does deal with the fact that we have to have uniforms but there needs to be a practical understanding from schools on how to implement their policies. I often worked with young people with regard to attendance. I worked in the school completion programme where attendance was a big thing. What we would find was that a young person would eventually get to school after being suspended due to behaviour, or after a long absence, only to be told they were wearing the wrong colour shoes, the wrong tie or they forgot this or that. That is ridiculous because the child is sent home to get the proper uniform. Schools need to be practical about this. Yes, uniforms are extremely expensive. Some people might forget them but others may not have them. Where I am coming from, and this is where it speaks to Sinn Féin's Bill, some children and young people do not have the uniforms because they are just so expensive. On that basis, a family cannot afford to replace the tie. The easiest part of the school uniform to get lost is the tie. They do not know where it is. It falls down the back of the radiator or wherever but it is gone. It is expensive to replace it. I do not know why school uniforms need to have a tie in the first place but that is probably a side part of this.

School jumpers, as has been said by many, are very expensive. Students grow out of them, they lose them, they get holes in them, somebody else take them or whatever. Schools have to have a practical way of dealing with this. Having generic uniforms, if they have to have them, is so important.

Recently I had students Clogher Road Community College in. They were doing leaving certificate applied, LCA, work experience with me. I asked them to do a project on what their ideal school would be. They had a long list and one of the things they had on the list was no school uniform. They do not have a uniform in the school they go to but they were both in schools previously where they did have a uniform. They feel much better in themselves not having to wear a school uniform.

My last point on this, before I go back to the substantive part, is I know people argue that if we do not have a school uniform, it can lead to competition as to what clothes students wear. School culture is very important in this. I have been involved in multi-denominational schools for a long time and what I found was that there is no uniform in those schools but there is not that competition and the reason for that is that the students kind of have their own uniforms, which is leggings and a hoodie or jeans or tracksuit bottoms and a hoodie. They fall into what it is and there is not that big competition.

However, this Bill is about the cost of living and supporting families in a situation where it is so expensive to put their children through our free education system. As previous speakers said, this is where the problem is - it is not free. I have mentioned Circular 32/17 several times in the Dáil because I thought I might have imaged that circular came out because nothing ever seems to have happened about it. I was delighted when it came out for the kids we supported in our project. All school completion programmes and all schools working in disadvantaged areas have a bank of uniforms in case somebody forgets something. In our project, Ballymun ansoe school completion programme, we had a washing machine and dryer so we could wash uniforms. We had a stock of uniforms so we could replace them for families who could not afford to replace them themselves. We had the facility to wash and dry uniforms, if that was necessary. Sometimes if a student only has one uniform and if that uniform gets dirty on a Monday in the yard or during sport, it will be dirty for the remainder of the week because he or she does not have a second one. When a uniform is really expensive, it is hard to replace it. If they were generic, it would not be as hard to replace them. Previous speakers said that if the polo shirt is a generic that can be bought anywhere, that is great but if it is an expensive one, a family might have one or might have none.

If we have circulars and there are things set out by the Department that schools are supposed to do and they are not doing them, what is the consequence? What is the point in somebody in the Department of education writing a circular, saying this is what we want the school to do but then it does not happen? What role does the Minister of State have in making sure that happens because this Bill would not have had to have been brought forward if what was set out in the circular was being done? The circular said uniforms should be generic, practical and the costs for families should be reduced as much as possible but yet all we hear this evening is that this is not the case. We have a situation where school uniforms are expensive and families are struggling and coming to the end of August and beginning of September, they are thinking about what they will do if there is not that culture within the school to have swaps when students grow out of things. I think a lot of schools are doing that and getting used to the idea but there are schools that are not because people are contacting us asking us if this can be brought in and asking if anything can be done.

Students have to have uniforms, tablets and books. I am constantly puzzled that they have to have tablets and books. There are exam costs, voluntary contributions, which really are not voluntary in some cases, and other costs associated with going to school such as lunches. I know there are free lunches but not everybody eats the free lunches. If education was truly free, there would not be costs for any of these things.

We have one in five children living in poverty. The reality is that we have the Society of St. Vincent de Paul delivering food and we have food banks. We have families who go to different places to pick up food every single week. Uniforms are the last thing they can deal with or else uniforms are the thing they focus on because they know it is the thing that will draw attention to the student, in that they are different and are not the same as everybody else because they do not have the school uniform or the uniform is dirty. What it means is they buy the school uniform but then they do not have any other clothes because it is either-or. It sounds like we are talking about the 1980s or previous times but we are not. This is 2025 and this is happening for families.

What I and the Social Democrats are saying is that if we want to have free education in this country, which we keep saying we want to have, it will not be free as long as we have these costs that cannot be kept down to a minimum. It is so easy to do that but it needs to be policed. Not only do uniforms need to be affordable but they need to be comfortable and practical. Girls wearing shorts or shirts that are down to their ankles or up to their knees or wherever is not practical. How are they supposed to cycle? They will not cycle in a skirt that goes up to here or is down to their ankles. It is dangerous and they will not feel comfortable in it. How will a transgender child wear a uniform that is assigned to one gender or the other? There has to be flexibility in that.

In regard to having items that are compulsory and items that are not, some schools I have been involved in have had a tracksuit but the tracksuit did not have the iron on crest but rather the crest you have to buy and that is the problem because they are the expensive things.

I thank Sinn Féin for bringing this Bill forward. I echo my colleague from the Labour Party in saying I am disappointed the Government cannot see that this Bill has to be brought forward because what was already set out in that circular is not happening. When the Government implements things, it needs to follow up on them. It is really important. We are trying to make the lives of young people easier and make it easier for them to learn.

In regard to children with additional needs, uniforms need to be practical for those students as well because it is really important they are comfortable and do not have sensory overload from uniforms that are itchy or uncomfortable. I am disappointed the Government will not support this Bill. The Social Democrats will support it.

It is important that any family sending their children to school should not be going to a loan shark, a credit union, a bank or other family members to be able to just have this basic thing, which is being able to send their children to school knowing they are not going to go hungry themselves or that their children will not go hungry, or that the children would be shamed because they do not have the uniform because they cannot afford it. I thank Sinn Féin for bringing this Bill forward.

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