John McGuinness (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I first acknowledge the great staff in the HSE across the country. This is not a criticism of them. When something like this happens, we must reflect on why it has happened. I also acknowledge the work being undertaken by the new Minister and Ministers of State. I appreciate their commitment to getting things right and to the reform that is necessary. However, that commitment is going to be tested. In many of the contributions to this debate, Members have referred to systemic failure. There was not a systemic failure; people failed. They failed the young children of this country because nobody was prepared to shout loud enough to stop what was going on. That non-medical metal springs were used is outrageous. It does not matter if they were used on one child, ten children or whatever the number may be. The fact it might be a small number makes no difference. It happened. It was allowed to happen and nobody cried, "Stop". Without the whistleblower, where would we be?

As in many other cases, we are now at a point whereby systemic failure and communication are being blamed. A whistleblower has come forward and I wonder how that whistleblower is going to be penalised.

That is the way the HSE and the system operates. We will have another debate on Thursday and it is the same system and the same reasons, and nobody is mentioning sanctions or people or exposing the truth. When the audit is completed, I would like to see it published fully without redactions and dealing with the issues with less of the padding that goes with all of these reports.

HIQA found the controls in place in CHI for the management of end-to-end processes did not provide adequate safeguards. That is a truly shocking statement. We in this House can become numb to what is said and how it is said. We have to keep on checking ourselves; it is people we are talking about and it is young children we are talking about.

I do not doubt the Minister's credentials for achieving what she wants to achieve but in her opening remarks she addressed the issue of communication. How many of the children with autism and their families who cannot access proper services were contacted? How many of them are on waiting lists for assessment, for a place in an ASD unit or for having their issues dealt with? If I was to judge from my constituency of Carlow-Kilkenny, I would say there is a shocking number of children involved in this and they are not being communicated with or getting the services. I do not want to take from the debate about CHI but I want to say to the Minister that it is the very same for those with autism. She mentioned the communication piece. I would like to see a communication piece in relation to those who have been left out of the system without being looked after or protected. I would like to know they will be protected in the future and will get services not in the future but now. I could name a list of families that are affected, but suffice it to say there is a considerable number. Can I get them to contact someone directly in the Minister's office? Can I ask directly that each of those families be communicated with? The 2023 protected disclosure led to the then Minister being informed in May 2024. If we are that concerned about the children of this country, why has it taken so long for this to come to light and be dealt with in the appropriate manner, and for us to have this debate? It is because this is another cover-up and another attempt to hide the truth and allow the Department and CHI to put a narrative out there and fail to deliver again in terms of the audit. I hope I am wrong and there is a new day and a new departure, but I doubt it very much because the culture within CHI and the HSE is so corrupt that they first set out not to deal with the issues but to cover up the truth. This is a fact borne out by many reports. I say again that shortly there will be the ongoing scandal of children with autism not being supported.

I finish by reiterating my original point, which is that it was not systemic failure. It was the failure of people in management positions who could have cried "Halt" to all of this. We may get some satisfaction out of airing our views in this House but I will not be satisfied until I see someone accepting responsibility for the failure to deal with this issue and the many other issues facing the children of this country.

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