Alan Kelly (Tipperary North, Labour) | Oireachtas source

We have a lot to get through. The CSO statistics were worrying when it came to the increase in burglaries and many other crimes. Notwithstanding this, I believe the Irish public respect An Garda Síochána and has huge support for it. However, it is a force that is in crisis. I represent Templemore. There are huge issues across the board, primarily recruitment and retention, an area which is in total crisis. Unless there are radical changes, which, in fairness to the Minister, I have spoken to him about very briefly, I do not believe there is a hope of reaching the targets he has set.

Trainees are not paid enough. Wages and pensions will not entice people to join. A salary of €40,000 might seem like a lot of money, but coming to live in Dublin from down the country for that salary is not enticing in modern times. The age, educational requirements and fitness requirements have been dropped. The Minister will disagree, but despite dropping all of that people do not have to be fully vetted. I believe we are in serious trouble. I will write to every other State agency and Department in the country to see if the precedent set by An Garda Síochána can be used across every other agency as regards vetting. For me, this is non-negotiable. The public does not get this. People should be fully vetted before they enter Templemore.

Gardaí lack basic equipment. Sick leave is not being covered. Drugs and community Garda units are being filled, but there is no backfilling. Current Garda divisions, including Tipperary and east Clare, in my constituency, are not working. The 999 call system to Cork is nuts. It is a joke. Simply put, morale is on the floor.

The Minister said he will not attend the GRA conference. I believe that is a huge mistake. He should set a new line and attend it. The previous Minister did not attend because the Commissioner was not invited. If the Minister does not attend, I will. Somebody from the House should attend the conference. The Oireachtas should be represented there.

Gardaí do not feel that the Commissioner or the last Government have their back because they did not feel the last Government or Minister did. I am giving this Government a chance; it is to be hoped it will have their backs. Many questionable decisions have been made regarding how members of the force have been treated over the past number of years. I have spoken in the House about Limerick and issues in Dublin.

Those who have made protected disclosures or speak up often suffer as a result. One of the Minister's predecessors said in the House that what happened to Maurice McCabe can never happen again, and I hope the Minister will bring fresh eyes to the protected disclosures that have been made and their outcomes. I am thinking of John Barrett, the former head of HR, and how he was treated. I am thinking of Lois West, the former senior analyst who did statistics. I am thinking of those people as I stand here because they were treated very badly. I believe GSOC is not fit for purpose. I have to ask a question on the floor of the Dáil. Who is watching the watchers? It is a real issue.

In the time I have remaining, I want to raise some important issues and I hope the Minister takes them in a genuine way because they are issues I feel strongly about. As the Minister will be aware, over the past number of weeks I have asked a number of significant parliamentary questions of the Minister's Department regarding dangerously defective leather pistol holsters that were procured in a saddlery in Kildare. They were an issue until 23 March 2023, at which time, I understand, the Garda Commissioner advised the Minister's office that the holsters had been removed and shredded beyond use. I take it the Minister is familiar with these questions. In parliamentary question reference no. 3825/25, I asked whether concerns were raised.

The Minister did not respond that any concerns had been raised.

I asked for clarification from the Minister's Department and, amazingly, we suddenly found out concerns were raised in 2022. I then said that this was wrong, that it turns out concerns were raised in 2020. That is three responses to one letter. With these results, I am concerned about the Minister's departmental functioning. If they were all removed and shredded, as the Minister said in his response to my question, why can I get my hands on as many of them as I want, including the one I am holding in my hand now? These are the defective holsters.

I wish for the House to be aware that following an accidental discharge of an official issued Garda firearm on 11 June outside the Israeli Embassy, which resulted in life-changing injuries to the member carrying the weapon, it was discovered by forensic experts attached to the Garda National Technical Bureau that the leather pistol holster issued to the member was so dangerously defective, the holster could actually engage the trigger and fire the weapon of its own accord. It was further identified by the ballistic experts, who operate under ISO/IEC 17025 accreditation, which is the legal requirement for all forensic laboratories, that the holster was so poorly designed, the firearm could be removed from the holster with so-called retention strap fully fastened. This left the gun open to removal by individuals other than the Garda member carrying the firearm. This critical health and safety risk later became the subject of a warning notice from the acting head of the Garda National Technical Bureau, given the very real concerns for the safety of Garda members.

Unfortunately, approximately one week later, on the night of 17 June 2020, the late Detective Garda Colm Horkan was murdered with his own official Garda firearm following an engagement with a now convicted murderer, Stephen Silver. There is no doubt Stephen Silver was the person who ultimately murdered Detective Garda Horkan. I am now aware, however, that the late detective was wearing one of the defective leather pistol holsters procured from the same equine saddlery in Kildare. Given what was known about the leather pistol holster removed from the scene of the accidental discharge on 11 June, a week earlier, the question must be asked whether the defective holster should have been investigated for that incident as well. The Minister might ask whether the forensic examination undertaken by the GNTB, as the expert forensic service to An Garda Síochána, showed Detective Garda Horkan's holster was also defective. For reasons unknown to me and the members of the GNTB, however, and this is the critical point, Detective Garda Horkan's holster was never presented to the GNTB for ballistic examination, despite the holster being gathered by GNTB crime investigators, bagged and tagged as a ballistic exhibit. The holster was labelled as DOL2A, in case the Minister wants to enquire from the Garda Commissioner why the exhibit was not presented to the appropriate section in An Garda Síochána.

Why was Detective Garda Horkan's holster not examined by a professional person qualified in the area under the standards required? Why was the safety notice issued to all chief superintendents in July 2020 and put on the Garda portal system in September 2020 not removed until 2023? Why did the Garda Commissioner not use the GNTB to assess the ballistics and other evidence from the shooting and murder of Detective Garda Horkan? Why was there a second report requested into the original incident outside the Israeli Embassy, which, amazingly, contradicted the first report saying the holster was defective? Why did the Garda Commissioner not issue a section 41 to notify the Minister of the issues regarding the holsters following two incidents, especially after notices had been put on Garda internal systems? Why did GSOC stop investigating a protected disclosure made in 2019 by someone working in firearms who had concerns regarding the holster? Is the Minister aware it was because of the non-compliance of the Commissioner following a level 4 request? Why did the Commissioner seek to remove a warning notice regarding the holsters in early 2020 when he could not have known whether they had all been handed in and replaced? These are serious questions. I tabled a pile of parliamentary questions to the Minister across several weeks, as he is aware. I would like him to take this on and investigate it further. I have exhausted how far I can take this and that is why I have raised it on the floor of the Dáil with him.

I also want to raise the issue of the 392 abandoned firearms left, inexplicably, in a container inside Garda Headquarters. This is an image of the inside of the container. I will give this image to the Minister. This is how firearms were stored by An Garda Síochána. A total of 392 firearms were discovered, with documentation located for only 102 firearms and no documentation found for the remaining 290 lethal firearms. Of the 392 firearms, only 154 were recorded on PULSE and 92 had no serial number. The Minister must accord the media reports which point out a Winchester pump-action shotgun was taken in by An Garda Síochána, first in 2009 under PID6311647 and, second, in 2023 under PID22772305. I understand this has been investigated by An Garda Síochána but why was a section 41 on this not put to the Minister on time? It is concerning section 41s are not being put to the Minister on time.. I am really concerned about why it took eight months for the Garda Commissioner to report this to the Minister's Department. Why did it take so long? There is a deep concern about this and what else we do not know regarding how firearms are managed, what happened inside that container and if there were any other instances we do not know about.

I have several other issues which I will raise with the Minister at another time, but I wish to raise one more. It relates to the discovery of 8 kg of pure cocaine mistakenly dumped by Forensic Science Ireland. Was the Minister alerted by either the Garda Commissioner or the director general of Forensic Science Ireland that, in April 2019, when Forensic Science Ireland, an agency within the Department of Justice was disposing of items, including a locker, in a basement area within the Garda Headquarters complex, those who were brought in from outside, a private company, realised the locker was heavier than all the other lockers, and when they opened it, out fell 8 kg of cocaine. How in the name of God did that happen? How was this possible and what knowledge did the Department have in this regard? Only for the fact the private company was so honourable, that cocaine could have ended up back on the streets. The company obviously dealt with it appropriately.

I have many more issues like those I have just raised, some very serious, to discuss with the Minister again. I will support him if he looks backwards as well as forwards in respect of the challenging issues we have in policing and in An Garda Síochána. I told him this to his face less than two hours ago, but please, Minister, make your own judgements and put fresh lenses on everything that has happened. Do not depend on just your Department. If you do that, I will support you. If he do that, you will be a successful Minister. If you do not, I guarantee on the floor of this Dáil that you will not.

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