Jennifer Carroll MacNeill (Dún Laoghaire, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Deputy. This is what we are trying to do all the time, which is to work within a European structure. We are one of 27. Ireland has 14 MEPs out of 720. We advocate as strongly as we can but we must not overstate our position or relevance either. If we are one of a club we have to respect that we are one of a club and that we work within a consensus environment. This is what we are trying to do. We are trying to show solidarity to our eastern partners as they showed solidarity to us during Brexit. We are trying to show solidarity with Italy and Greece in relation to migration as they have shown solidarity to us on different matters. To take a collective approach, which is always the best approach that can be taken in Europe, requires becoming interested in things that are not directly impacting us and requires us to do more to share in a generous and in a real way the challenges that we definitely share together.

One of those important challenges is in relation to security and defence. There was dialogue here today about a European defence union, which is not a formal proposal. What is on the cards is recognising the changed risk over the last three years to countries within the European Union including Ireland, and that there be a different way of looking at the financing, or more properly the organisation, of access to defence materials. In Ireland, we want to increase our spending in the Defence Forces from €1.2 billion to at least €1.5 billion. We want to do that through recruitment and through the purchase of materials to be used by members of our Defence Forces. I would rather that be done on a pan-European basis whereby we can benefit from economies of scale, access to supply chains, and better value to the taxpayer than doing it unilaterally. This is in the same way that we took the shared collective approach during Covid, which was referred to by Deputy McGuinness. That was a collective approach that benefited Ireland in terms of vaccines.

Deputy McGuinness and another Member mentioned a drifting away from a Europe that is becoming more bureaucratic and that our politicians were perhaps not strong enough to advance the Irish position. I would never be brave enough to say that to former MEP Deputy Marian Harkin, and I would never be brave enough to say that to MEP Frances Fitzgerald. The MEPs we elect are phenomenal advocates for Ireland. The people who work in Europe on our behalf in the Commission and in the permanent representation are there only to work to advance Ireland's interests. They try to do that in the alliances we have, whether it is the Nordic-Baltic group, in terms of how we approach the financing and the funding of Europe, or whether it is in the context of what we are going to have to think about on security and defence. I do not want to have to stand up here and talk about security and defence. That is not what I got into politics for, but the risk in Europe has changed and the response by Europe is proportionate to that.

There are planes flying in over Lithuania from Russia. There is weaponised migration. There are constant cyberattacks, and Ireland is subject to these also. We are supportive of the EU-NATO work on hybrid attacks and cyberattacks and defending against that. Contrary to Deputy Carthy's position on the Defence Forces being insular, we actually want them to be able to benefit and train in de-mining, cybersecurity and a range of different areas that are strategically in Ireland's interests. We have joined a tailored partnership with NATO specifically to protect our undersea cables. We have been in a partnership with NATO in relation to peace since 1999. These are not new concepts, but we are going to have to think about them differently. As the dialogue relating to the funding of equipment for our Defence Forces to use in the defence of our sovereign territory becomes more acute, that is the way in which I suggest we should approach the conversation rather than assuming it is some effort to join NATO, which it is not. We are not militarily aligned and we have no notion of becoming militarily aligned. We do, however, want a strong Defence Forces in Ireland. I would like them to be equipped in the best way possible but in the most cost-effective and efficient way of doing so. That is the conversation we need to be having on security and defence in Europe.

See this speech in context