Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

As I mentioned, Ireland's pay gap is 11.3%, which is a narrower pay gap than the EU average. I am happy to say this is less bad and not better than, if Deputies prefer. It would be in line with some of the Nordic countries, which are often held up as examples for us to follow in terms of gender pay. My view is there should be no gender pay gap at all. The objective, therefore, must be 0%, or at least as close to statistical 0% as can be achieved. This will take some time. Very often, many factors are at play. Among these is not enough women being in senior positions. It is only as these vacancies arise that more women can be promoted into these senior positions. There is also a whole issue around increments. Men may be in employment for longer and have built up increments over time that give them higher pay for the same work. I do not think anyone in this House would propose that we remove increments to achieve gender equality, however.

In terms of the gender pay gap, there is a difference between the State pension and occupational pensions. I do not know what the gender pay gap is for the State pension, but I think it is much smaller than is the case for occupational pensions. Occupational pensions are related to the number of years people work and the amount they pay in. As more women enter the workforce and get better paid jobs and as we introduce auto-enrolment, I believe we will see this situation improve. It is fundamentally linked to the amounts people pay in. This is how that pension system works and that is fair.

Childcare is very expensive in Ireland. It is the objective of the Government to reduce the cost of childcare and early education for parents and to improve the quality of it. We have taken a big step forward in recent weeks by reducing the cost of childcare by 20% to 25%, which I think is significant. We want to reduce it further in 2024, subject to the public finances allowing this.

That can make a big difference in both reducing the cost of living for families and making it easier for parents, usually but not always women, to re-enter the workforce sooner than they otherwise would, if that is their choice. However, it is never as simple as just childcare. I think I remember reading of one of the Nordic countries - it might have been Denmark, Sweden or Norway - which has a public model of childcare and has very inexpensive childcare, and it actually has the same gender pay gap as we do or possibly a bigger one. We need to bear in mind that many factors are at play.

The Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, is introducing plans for paid leave for victims of domestic violence. This is a new form of leave and a significant step forward. We need to take into account that it will be an additional cost on employers, including very small businesses that might only have one or two staff and businesses along the Border which we always need to bear in mind because successive administrations north of the Border have failed to keep up with us in terms of workers' rights. That in turn holds us back because we need to have regard to the failure successive administrations in Northern Ireland to keep up with those when it comes to workers' rights and the impact that then has on small businesses on our side of the Border, for example. Deputies will be aware of many proposals for new forms of leave, which we need to consider in the round.

Childcare staff not being properly qualified is a matter for Tusla, but I will certainly inform the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, that Deputy Tóibín raised it in the Dáil today.

I broadly agree with Deputy Boyd Barrett's analysis of cleaners. Being a cleaner is increasingly a skilled job, more so than it was in the past and increasingly so in a healthcare setting where there are blood spills, personal protective equipment, PPE, and a need for infection control. There is an employment regulation order for contract cleaners. I am not sure if that applies to the group the Deputy is talking about. I have not seen the evaluation report but I will make some further inquiries about it.

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