Simon Harris (Wicklow, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank everyone for coming to this debate on Carlow College. I jest, but only a bit. I know how important the issue of Carlow College is to the people of Carlow. I know important it is to Deputy Murnane O'Connor. I acknowledge the very regular contact the Deputy and I have on this matter. I hope we can make real progress. I, too, pay tribute to Father Con. He is a superb leader and a very decent individual working with a great management team in Carlow College, a college that has contributed a huge amount to Carlow and the south east. It has also provided access to third level education in Carlow to a group of people who, perhaps, at least back in the day would not have had that access otherwise. The Deputy knows the answer to the effect that where it fits in the technological university is a matter for the technological university. She, I and the Government want to ensure that enough time and space is provided for the technological university to be able to consider that and that, in the interim, we continue to support Carlow College. Legals are being considered on both sides. I share the Deputy's view that this is a matter that should be progressed expeditiously. I will keep in very close contact with her on the matter as I know she will with me.

On DkIT, I thank Deputies Ó Murchú and Fitzpatrick for raising the matter again. I wish to very clearly restate my absolute commitment to the north east having a technological university. This is something we are united on across all sides and parties of the House. Deputy Fitzpatrick talked about my frustration in the past regarding the north east not getting an application in. That is true but we have moved on from that now. This is about getting a solution. I am very pleased that for the very first time I am aware of, we now have the management team, staff representatives, student representatives and governing authority all having one shared vision that they want to be a part of a technological university for the north east. We have provided funding through the transformation fund. We have provided expert advice through Dr. Neavyn. I take the point Deputy Ó Murchú made on the metrics.

We work very closely on this and we will keep in contact.

It was a pleasure to meet Deputy Ó Murchú's nieces. The school very kindly presented me with this tie, which I promised I would wear in the Dáil. We all had a laugh, on an occasion of celebration, about a member of the family of a Sinn Féin Deputy having to get a photograph with a Fine Gael Minister. It was a very pleasant night and it was very nice to meet the Deputy's family. I did not try to politically convert them and I do not believe I would have been successful anyway. However, it was lovely to be in the school. I pay tribute to the Príomhoide, Mr. Tomás Sharkey, who is well known to the Deputy. He is an excellent Principal and is held in very high regard by the community.

Deputy Pringle referred to Killybegs. I share his view. The strength of a technological university is its multi-campus approach. People should see that as a strength. While it is not a particular issue in the north west, some people talk about technological universities as if they were all about their town, particularly in larger towns. It is actually about a region. It is about the north west and working as a region. The Killybegs campus has a very important role to play in this regard. It actually came up in a conversation I had with the president of Atlantic Technological University, Professor Orla Flynn, last week. She was at Killybegs campus very recently. I intend to visit the campus, either during the summer, if that is appropriate for it, or just at the start of the new academic year. I will certainly let the Deputy know when I am going there. I share his view that it has potential and will require investment. We will work with the Deputy and other Donegal representatives on that. The Killybegs campus has an important role to play in the Atlantic Technological University.

There are a couple of other issues to touch on. I accept that student accommodation represents a very significant issue. I also accept that if we can get it right, it will become a lever not only to make progress for students but also to help address the housing issue overall. If we can provide students, who are competing with a family to rent a three-bedroom terraced house, with student accommodation, there will be a double benefit. The Minister for Housing, Local Government and Heritage and I have been discussing this. I am due to update the Cabinet committee on housing on some proposals and ideas we have on this at its next meeting. To be blunt, it will require the State to make a subvention. Much college-owned accommodation could be built if we get the model right.

In the short term, there is more student accommodation this year than there was last year. Nine hundred and seventy new units have been constructed in the past two years, and I think 929 more are under construction. We have changed the law to ensure students do not have to pay for many months of rent up front. We are now giving the technological universities the ability to access the borrowing framework to build. I am meeting presidents and chairpersons of universities and colleges this month to talk about further local solutions that can be effected in the interim.

I was taken by the comments of Deputies Ó Cuív and O'Donoghue on public transport. As I travel around the country, it comes up that better public transport in rural areas could lessen the need for student accommodation in that there are students who would not necessarily move out of their homes if they had public transport. I will take this up further with my colleague the Minister for Transport, Deputy Eamon Ryan. I thank the Minister for Transport for the measures he has introduced to reduce public transport fees, particularly the 50% reduction for those under 24, many of whom are students.

I was struck by the comments on apprenticeships and pathways. A couple of Deputies made a point in this regard that I know they did not mean, but I want to clarify the position because we must use language correctly in this House. An apprenticeship is a form of third-level education. It is not a question of third level or an apprenticeship; it is just a question of what form of third level. We have got to get that right. I make the mistake sometimes too. An apprenticeship is a third level education; it is just a different way of getting it. All of us beginning to speak like this helps with the status aspect to which Deputy Ó Cuív alluded.

It definitely has to be about pathways. One of the key requirements we have in the reform agenda, in return for sustainably funding higher education, is a unified third level education system. I refer to apprenticeships, further education and higher education all working more closely together.

Deputy Conway-Walsh and others raised the cost of education, as did many others. I am very clear and get that we have to do more. I am pleased that we are beginning to move in relation to improving student grants. I accept that there is more to do, as the student grant review states very clearly. The paper on the cost of education will afford an opportunity to all of us to put our cards on the table regarding what we believe are the next best moves to make in the budget. The timing of the changes and how we introduced them are matters to tease through as part of the Estimates process.

I want to comment on the issue of students studying the English language here and the way they were treated, as raised by Deputy Conway-Walsh. I want to be very careful about what I say because, despite my being protected by parliamentary privilege, I am conscious that the report relates to an illicit arrangement. There are legal protections in place for all tenants, including students. There is also the Residential Tenancies Board. I am sure all of us hope that the full rigours of all these protections will be explored. My office will be in close contact, including this afternoon, with Ms Laura Harmon, who heads up the organisation representing international students here. We will do all we can to provide them with information and support. Deputy Conway-Walsh should note that we intend to move forward with the international education mark. I expect it to be in place by the beginning of 2023 and to have detailed information in the autumn of this year on how it will be rolled out. I am happy to provide the Deputy with a briefing on that.

The issue of visas for J1 students is not a matter for my Department but one that I will take on board. The point made in this regard was a fair one.

I take the point on wanting to increase SUSI thresholds. People are being assessed on last year's income level. It is retrospective for 12 months, so people are not feeling the full whack of the inflationary measures yet.

I will leave it at that. We now have the key ingredients in place. We are seeing the benefit of a full Department of State working on these policy issues. I pay tribute to the people working in our Department and agencies. They have worked extremely hard over the past two years, not just in dealing with Covid and its impact on education but also in trying to put in place some of the key blocks, including the Higher Education Authority Bill, which is currently going through this House, and the future funding plan, on which there has been ducking and diving for too long regarding how we properly fund higher education. That question has now been addressed and we have to get on with the implementation. Other elements include the SUSI review, the work on the cost of education and the new national access plan coming at the end of this month. There is a lot of work to be getting on with. I look forward to keeping in close contact with colleagues.

See this speech in context