Jennifer Whitmore (Wicklow, Social Democrats) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Minister of State for the opportunity to have this debate today. It was a pleasant surprise to see it on this week’s agenda. I was anticipating perhaps some announcement from the Government in regard to just transition and the plans for it. I am disappointed with the level of progress outlined today. From listening to and reading the Minister of State’s speech, it seems that one thing is missing all the time. I do not know why the Government is so hesitant to put it down in black and white what it means by “just transition”. How is this defined? It is one of those phrases that gets trotted out at regular intervals by people in government and in opposition yet we have no actual definition of what a just transition is. Until we have a definition there is absolutely no way anyone can be held accountable for meeting or not meeting it. In the absence of a definition, how do Departments, Ministers, NGOs or local authorities know whether they are doing the right thing? A definition would provide a checklist for Government and for everyone to say what their policy is, that they meet this aspect of just transition, that they see the economic transition is not great and have identified social consequences and that they will ensure there are no social consequences. We need a checklist and a definition would give us that. I and others tried to get a definition into the climate Bill but the Government refused to take that on board. I tried to get a definition into the recent circular economy Bill but, again, the Government refused to take that on board. It is not that it has not been done in other places. Scotland has done it. I do not understand the hesitancy in government to put down what a just transition is to ensure it is not just a term trotted out when it is expedient for Government.

I welcome the fact the Minister of State outlined the just transition principles in his speech. He talked about placing social dialogue at the heart of climate policy.

It is important to namecheck the trade union movement in that. Just transition started off as a trade union and workers issue. It is broader than that but it is important that the work, dialogue and contribution of trade unions is acknowledged and that the part they can play be counted in the principles.

Principle No. 3 states: "That the costs are shared so that the impact is equitable and existing inequalities are not exacerbated." The Government should be more ambitious. Not only should we make sure that existing inequalities are not exacerbated but we should be ambitious about making sure we start addressing those inequalities. Now is the time we are at a crossroads and have opportunities to use the environmental, social and economic change that we will have to implement to meet our climate targets. Let us use this as an opportunity to make things better and ensure we do not make things worse. I ask that the Minister of State reflect that in the policies.

I do not get a sense of urgency with just transition. The Minister of State talked about the just transition commission, which was a programme for Government commitment and which is a commitment under the climate action plan. However, I understand it will be 2023 before that is established. That will be three years into the Government and a year to a year and a half after the Climate Action and Low Carbon Development (Amendment) Act 2021 was passed. There is no point in doing this work after the policies and the legislation are in place. Just transition needs to be a foundation and the framework by which policies are developed. It should not be brought in after the fact because that will undermine the policies. Just transition needs to be developed now and the commission is needed now, as quickly as possible. This is something I have been raising since I was elected and I reintroduced a Bill of the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan’s on a just transition commission because I recognised that it was something that had to be done quickly. The time for talking is over and it is time for action now. There is a risk of these policies being developed in a way that will make things worse for people and that then the commission will come in and try to rectify that practice. I ask, therefore, that there be some sense of urgency with this.

When we look at the record of Government to date in rolling out programmes, we must ask if it has taken just transition into account to date and I would have to say it has not. There have been attempts, such as the retrofitting programme, which is targeting low income households and people on social welfare with grants. However, there is a huge swathe of people, including low to middle income earners, who need to make changes and who will be getting little support from the Government when it comes to retrofitting. There was an opportunity to target those people and to apply just transition principles to ensuring the retrofitting programme did what it should have done, which unfortunately did not happen.

The Minister of State said that there needs to be social dialogue and that the Government needs to listen and consult and I ask him to reflect on the discussions we had on turf recently. Some 3,500 people engaged with that consultation process and it was clear from the consultation report that people did not know what the Government regulations were about. They thought it was a ban on turf and they told the Government that. The Government did the consultation but it did not listen and that is an important point to make. If the Government is talking about just transition and engaging with communities, then it should take what they say on board and listen to them.

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