Dáil debates

Tuesday, 17 May 2022

National Maternity Services: Motion [Private Members]

 

7:30 pm

Photo of Catherine ConnollyCatherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent) | Oireachtas source

I thank Sinn Féin once again for giving us the opportunity by tabling this motion. With regard to what Deputy Michael Healy-Rae said, I do not think I want to be God but if I was arrogant enough to go down that road, I would choose to be a goddess, maybe, and do it completely differently.

With regard to this matter, words fail me in relation to the hypocrisy. I am on record for praising the Minister of State, Deputy Butler, for her hands-on approach but on this issue, I fundamentally disagree with her. Two weeks ago, this was paused, ostensibly to give us a chance to reflect and see what would emerge.

I read all of documents as best I could. I am no expert and I struggled with them. They raised more questions than provided answers. What deeply disturbs me is the narrative that has come from the Government, with certain Deputies who were on the Joint Committee on Health, that played the man rather than the issue. I stayed late on Thursday - not as late as I should have but as long as I could - and I really witnessed a deplorable display of tackling the person as opposed to eliciting information. I am not here to tackle or to give out about nuns. I was educated by nuns. I am not here to even talk about nuns. I am here to talk about why we do not have a public hospital on a public site.

The response from St. Vincent's Healthcare Group that it needs ownership to have an integrated service is nothing short of pathetic and unacceptable to me as a woman and a female Deputy. That the Government would accept that is also unacceptable to me. Let us look at how we have gone around in a circle. Let us look also at what Mr. James Menton said on record back in 2017. On 30 May 2017, the day after the Religious Sisters of Charity announced its intention to depart the St. Vincent's Healthcare Group, Mr. Menton said that the move "will only proceed on the basis of existing agreements that give ownership and control of the new hospital to St Vincent’s Healthcare Group." "Ownership and control" is clearly stated. Fast-forward to 2022 and that is exactly what we are giving to a trinity of control. Little things have changed, such as changes with directorship in terms of numbers and a golden share. Nowhere is the process of that golden share outlined.

I am addressing the Minister in particular because he has strong opinions on this. I am asking him to look at that trinity of ownership. St. Vincent's Holdings CLG is at the top of the pyramid. The Government has absolutely no say or influence; it has nothing. St. Vincent's Holdings CLG owned 100% of St. Vincent's Healthcare Group. There is no input from the Government whatsoever except perhaps through a director who will come up from the new designated company, which was established less than two years ago, that will run the hospital. That will comprise nine directors, three of whom will come from St. Vincent's Healthcare Group. Can the Minister tell me why they have to be there? Can he tell me why three directors from the owning group have to be on the hospital? Can he tell me why the director has to come from that group every three years? Can he tell me why there is no documentation or clarification, only once again assurances regarding the transfer - not a gifting but a transfer - of the land or asset owned by the nuns to the new company St. Vincent's Holdings CLG? Why can we not have that documentation? Were there any conditions? If not, wonderful - that means they can hand the land now to the State.

I hear this sort of disingenuous argument going around that we are against the nuns or against religion. That may well be, but that is not the issue at all. The issue in the 21st century is a public maternity hospital on a public site. Why? The reason is that is what the Dáil wants. That is what it said in regard to Sláintecare.

It is what the reports of both Dr. Butler and Dr. Catherine Day recommended in regard to moving away from private care in public facilities. Both reports were ignored by the Government and were not even mentioned by it.

I would have thought the Minister might have done us the decency of going through these issues with us and telling us his opinion on that. It is a deeply hypocritical stance to debate this motion after making the decision earlier in Cabinet and not even to wait for democracy, or the illusion thereof, in action. As a woman, I will not accept this. I cannot change the Government’s mind, but I can place on record that we saw through its spin, and in particular that of the Minister for Health, because that is all it is. It is absolute spin. I see through it and I am telling the people who are listening to this debate and who also see through it that I share that with them. It is unacceptable.

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