Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Leas-Cheann Comhairle agus leis na Teachtaí. I welcome the opportunity to discuss this important issue and I thank the Labour Party for using its time to discuss it today. The Government wants remote working, homeworking and blended working to become part of the new normal based primarily on choice. If done right the benefits will be significant in reduced business costs, better work-life balance, more balanced regional development, less traffic, fewer greenhouse gas emissions and time saved on the commute been used for a better purpose. Surveys done so far indicate that perhaps 10% or 20% of employees are keen to get back to the office as soon as possible. Another 10% to 20% would like to work from home permanently. The majority of employees want blended working, working some days in the office and some days at home or some days in a remote hub. That is what we should try to strive to facilitate.

We all know that the overuse of phones and digital devices has been linked to everything from stress, burnout and sleeplessness as well as to strained personal relationships from that device that is always on and never more than a few metres away, buzzing, flashing and beeping. This is an experience that all of us are familiar with given the jobs that we do. Many people admit that they are glued to their phones and laptops late into the evening. This phenomenon predates the pandemic and the creeping intrusion of electronic communications far beyond the normal working day, even into mealtime, is not just about remote working, nor is it new. While there are clear advantages to flexible working and working remotely, a long-acknowledged potential downside to the use of mobile and other electronic communications devices is the expectation that we are always switched on, always contactable and always available. That is not how it should be.

I welcome the Labour Party Bill as an important contribution to the debate in this area and the Government will not be opposing the Bill this morning. I agree that we need to reduce the intrusion of work-related digital devices after working hours in order to balance workers' professional and personal lives and we need to discuss how best we do that.

The Bill proposes to amend the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997 to provide employees working remotely with the right to switch off from work-related electronic communications out of working hours and to disapply certain provisions of the Safety, Health and Welfare at Work Act 2005. While supporting the central premise of this Private Members’ Bill, the proposed amendment to the Organisation of Working Time Act is quite rigid. It is important to consider the value that many workers place on workplace flexibility. Electronic communications play a central role in enabling that flexibility. Any new arrangements would need to consider the specific needs of the company and also the personal needs of the staff member, both of which are important. For instance, it would be meaningless and counter-productive to prevent an employee systematically from connecting after 7 p.m. when he or she is part of an international team that needs to communicate with people in different time zones. Similarly, later evening access would be useful for an employee who wants to stop working between 4 p.m. and 7 p.m. to take care of children and then reconnect in the evening when the children have gone to bed. People also often use their daily commute on a train or bus to get ahead of things before they arrive in the office. Being contactable and connected might actually allow that person to take that weekend away which might otherwise not be possible or to make it to children’s match or school play.

At the company level, new business models and global value chains with just-in-time production require increased flexibility. That flexibility for businesses and workers is important and we need to ensure that we safeguard it but we also need to ensure that it is not abused and that the proverbial baby is not thrown out with the bathwater to make remote working harder not easier. The challenge perhaps lies in differentiating between the misuse and abuse of digital tools and legitimate working arrangements that permit connections outside of standard working hours, which is sometimes for the employees convenience as much as it is for the business’s productivity.

Ireland also has a comprehensive body of employment legislation including the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997 which already sets out maximum working time and minimum rest periods for employees. Apart from a few limited exceptions, the terms of the Act apply to all employees regardless of whether they are based in an office, at home, or working remotely. The Act places an obligation on employers to ensure that their employees take regular rest breaks and do not work excessive hours. Under section 25 of the Act, an employer is obliged to keep records of working time of their employees. These records are subject to inspection by the Workplace Relations Commission, WRC. In practice, however, they still tend to operate on the old model in which work is done in a single designated workplace. We all know that has changed a great deal over the years.

That being said, I know that the right to disconnect has been a significant topic of debate both in Ireland and throughout Europe in recent years. There are several work strands to this issue which are already well underway. I should point out that commitments on remote working and indeed sick pay were made in the programme for Government published last June, none of which should be seen as a response to this Bill which came after that.

First, I will publish a remote working strategy before the end of the year. It will include proposals on a network of digital hubs to be built around the country, some of which are in place already, tax and expenses arrangements to facilitate remote working to ensure that the cost is borne fairly and benefits shared, the right to request work remotely and to have that considered properly and fairly, proposals on the right to disconnect and supports for businesses to make the digital transition.

Second, my office is currently examining the Organisation of Working Time Act 1997 in the context of the right to disconnect to consider deficiencies in the legislative framework that should be remedied. I recently asked the WRC to examine what can be done through the development of a new code of practice or set of guidelines to ensure that both employers and employees are aware of their existing requirements and entitlements under the Organisation of Working Time Act.

It is important that employers and employees alike understand the existing requirements and entitlements as they relate to the right to disconnect, including in a remote work scenario. I am conscious that any changes in this area need to strike a balance and to be based on consultation between employers and employees. That is how the best laws are made. I will discuss the national remote working strategy and the issues arising from it, including the right to disconnect, with unions and employer bodies this afternoon at a meeting of the leave subgroup which I chair in the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment.

I turn to the proposals for safety and health legislation. The underlying principle of the occupational safety and health legislation in Ireland is that workers enjoy the same basic entitlement to a safe and healthy work environment regardless of their status. Equally, all employers have the same basic duty of care to provide a safe and healthy work environment and to ensure work practices are conducted in as safe a manner as possible. While I accept the good intentions behind this Bill, my officials and I have some concerns that the proposed amendments could disapply aspects of the occupational safety and health legislation, may have the effect of compromising our robust legislative protections and could compromise the employer-employee relationship. It could actually diminish workers' rights in some circumstances and create new inequality between public and private sector workers, which we believe is undesirable. I appreciate that neither of these things is the intention of the Bill. Perhaps they can be teased out at the committee in pre-legislative scrutiny.

If people have difficulty or concern relating to the provision of a safe working environment when working from home, these concerns should be brought directly to the Health and Safety Authority, HSA, in the first instance because it can provide tailored, practical advice. I am confident that many genuine concerns can already be resolved within existing legal protections and we are keen to see more real-life cases being examined by the HSA and the WRC to test the effectiveness of existing laws and procedures.

One of the positive effects of our debates on our upcoming remote working strategy will be to encourage conversations between employers and their staff, with people working together to explore and agree what their expectations are, and, more importantly, to understand what their obligations are. At the very least, I believe every workplace should have a remote working policy dealing with matters such as the right to disconnect.

I think there is strong agreement across the House that remote working is a positive thing in the round and a general agreement on the issues we need to work on. The sudden shift to remote working this year, prompted by the pandemic, means that what might have happened in ten or 15 years happened in the course of a few days. It means that we as policymakers must now play catch-up. I am keen to move ahead as quickly as possible, starting with the publication of the remote working strategy next month, and I look forward to working with colleagues on these issues over the coming months.

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