Stephen Donnelly (Wicklow, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I am not giving the speech. It is probably not right to circulate it. I will try to cover the points made by each Deputy. I want to extend an offer to all colleagues to sit down with me after the debate if they want to discuss further issues if I do not get through their points.

Various Deputies raised the issue of Opposition briefings. I agree with the sentiment. As I have said in the Chamber, I do not believe there were sufficient Opposition briefings at the start of the pandemic. I have been working hard in the background to make that happen. There have been several briefings in the past number of weeks. There were Opposition briefings on level 5 and, I believe, level 3. Various Deputies contact me privately on a regular basis and I do my best to keep them up to date in that way.

There was a briefing with the HSE earlier today, that, as Deputy Cullinane said, unfortunately coincided with this debate which health spokespersons would want to attend. There were operational issues and even last night the Dáil scheduled was moving around. There was no intent there. There was a briefing on tiered penalties. Deputy Cullinane said I had not been made available. The Deputy and I spoke afterwards. I offered to brief the committee, and we offered a briefing from officials before the meeting if the committee so wished. That is what the health committee decided on.

I hear Deputies loud and clear. My preference is for as much interaction and briefing as possible. I do not think there was enough at the start and I am very happy to put my hands up on that. We have pushed for many more briefings. We now have standing fortnightly briefings in place. The CMO's office and HSE are involved. I am available to Deputies at any time. There have been briefings with the Taoiseach. We will endeavour to keep going and I hope Deputies have seen a difference in the past number of weeks. The change is one I intend to keep.

Deputy Cullinane referenced North-South co-operation. I want to agree with him but I also want to push back, if I may. There has been extensive interaction north and south of the Border between the authorities in the Six Counties and those in the Twenty-six Counties.

There has been extensive interaction between the Northern Ireland minister, Mr. Swann, and me, between the Taoiseach and the Northern Ireland First Minister and deputy First Minister, and between our Chief Medical Officer and the Northern Ireland Chief Medical Officer. The Minister for Foreign Affairs, Deputy Coveney, and I had one of the so-called quads recently with the Northern Ireland First Minister and Deputy First Minister as well as the Secretary of State and the CMO. There is a good deal of interaction. There is also interaction at a medical level, for example, between our intensivists north and south of the Border. There is a good deal of interaction. I would like to see an all-island approach. Considerable effort has been made.

I want to challenge Deputy Cullinane in turn because his party is uniquely positioned to help with this. While I accept his challenge that we continue to do everything we can, I maintain that Sinn Féin needs to do everything it can as well given that it is in government in Northern Ireland. Obviously, it is the largest party in opposition here. I would like to see Sinn Féin do everything it can as well.

Several Members have, quite fairly, asked for a helpline or even an email address that is responsive. I know one was set up when I was in opposition, although I am unsure whether I ever got a response from that email address. An email address on its own is not enough. It needs to be one from which Deputies get an answer. This came up previously and I have committed to it. I will get back to Deputies on that. I fully understand. Deputies, councillors and Senators are getting questions every day from the people they represent throughout the country. Every representative wants correctly to be able to get back and give the right information. Deputy Kelly referenced the same matter.

Various statements were made indicating it was not fair for big stores to sell food as well as non-essential items. This happened in the first wave. I agree, and I want to clarify for the House that it is not so much the stores that are deemed essential but the relevant goods that are deemed essential. A store cannot sell food in one part of the store and clothes in another part of the store. An example was given to me last night of a sports outlet that was going to start selling personal protective equipment so that it could also sell its normal sports apparel. That is not allowed. Such an outlet would be allowed to sell PPE but not the sports apparel. I agree with Deputies that this would be completely unfair.

Deputy Durkan raised the issue of compliance. Deputy Boyd Barrett and Deputy Barry had a different view on compliance. We will be discussing at some length the tiered penalty legislation tomorrow. I fully agree with Deputies, however, that it is relevant to the motion before us because it would essentially allow that legislation to operate.

I put it to Deputies that in the vast majority of cases what we are doing with tiered penalties is reducing the severity of the existing penalties. The only penalty available at the moment is a so-called penal provision. That involves a court case and a penalty of a fine of up to €2,500 and up to six months in prison. I do not believe that is appropriate in the majority of cases. What we are seeking to do is replace that with something more appropriate, for example, a €50 on-the-spot fine. This legislation is not about expanding enforcement but making it more appropriate. The single tool available now is not appropriate.

Deputy McNamara made an impassioned contribution on places of worship. I have considerable sympathy with him in that regard. As with the rest of level 5, we are following the public health advice on places of worship. I am happy to go back and challenge NPHET to provide the evidence again because I agree that this is a major imposition. I assure the Deputy and other colleagues that with regard to penalties, religious services are non-penal in that there is no penalty attached to them.

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