Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I accept that moving to level 5 creates a lot of anxiety, difficulties and challenges for people, particularly people in employment who will now lose their jobs and enterprises that have struggled through the pandemic and since reopening have been endeavouring through hard work and putting in place safe protocols to save their enterprises and keep them going which, to a large extent, many did. To be hit with a move to level 5 is a huge blow to them. That is accepted. That is why it is a difficult decision to move to level 5. I know from talking to all of the leaders over the past two weeks that all of them were of the view that moving to level 5 would be very difficult and that is the case. However, protection of public health is paramount. The virus thrives on congregation. Where large crowds gather, the virus spreads. That is the fundamental truth. Therefore, we have to avoid large crowds gathering in any context and mixing and engaging.

We are not proceeding with an elimination or zero-Covid strategy as a country. We are also not proceeding with a herd immunity strategy. This virus kills and it also damages people for the long term in that it can have long-term health implications. The strategy to be followed is one of suppression. Deputy McDonald mentioned that I held out the prospect last evening that we were in a cycle. We are, but it is very much subject to human behaviour and all of us reducing congregation and gatherings of people in large numbers. I am not saying that. NPHET has said this to us. I am being very candid with the Oireachtas. I foresee periods of high level restrictions followed by low level restrictions and, if necessary, followed by high level restrictions again if the virus spreads during the reopening phase.

On testing capacity, we are testing far more people than we did in the first phase. The Chief Medical Officer said on "News at One" that we are testing at an unprecedented rate right now. The serial testing programmes are picking up a lot of cases, particularly in nursing homes and other locations, including in schools where up to 13,000 students and teachers have been tested and the positivity rate is around 3%. It is important that we set as a societal objective and priority that we keep our schools going.

Deputy McDonald spoke about people having a roof over their head. We are allowing construction to continue because we have a homeless crisis, a housing crisis and we need to build homes. We lost ground during the first lockdown. The construction sector here took a bigger hit than was the case in any other country across Europe. As a result of the lockdown, we are behind in terms of output and houses built. Prior to the formation of the new Government, we were behind in meeting targets for 2020 because of the lockdown. We must allow house construction to continue because of the crisis in homelessness, the lengthy social housing lists and housing need generally.

On the all-island approach, Deputy McDonald is well aware of the situation. Her party is in government in the North and she realises more than anyone in this House the difficulties and sensitivities of endeavouring to reach an agreement within the North, never mind on an all-island basis. I have been in touch with party leaders in the North. Whether it will move to a higher level is a matter for the Northern Executive. It has had challenges and difficulties in arriving at the decision it reached last week.

On the banks, the Deputy knows well that the European Banking Authority co-ordinated a Europe-wide approach to mortgage breaks and loan repayment breaks in the context of the first lockdown, which was Europe-wide. That was the context in which Government could do what it did on that occasion. The Minister for Finance will be engaging with the banks on this issue. Our entire approach has been to alleviate as much distress as possible, increasing and bringing in new tiers for the pandemic unemployment payment and the employment wage subsidy scheme and the introduction in the budget of the new Covid restrictions subsidy scheme for companies that will be closed for longer periods as a result of this pandemic.

All of our approach has been to try to help where we can to alleviate the stress and pressures on people.

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