Michael McNamara (Clare, Independent) | Oireachtas source

Further to what Deputy Healy-Rae was saying, my understanding, if I am not incorrect about what Deputy Howlin is proposing, is that if a pub is closed for a day, it would not be conclusive that it was correct to close it for a day. Moreover, if that is being used against a publican in subsequent legal proceedings, for example, when he is renewing his licence in September, then he can then go behind that and say that he accepts that it was closed for a day but he does not accept that it was correct to do so. I think that is the effect of Deputy Howlin's amendment, if I am not incorrect.

I am very much interested in the Minister's response to this, because at the moment it would seem to me that of course a publican can challenge being closed for a day long after the premises has been closed for a day. I would be interested to see how the Minister suggests we can remedy that. The Minister may say judicial review is the avenue. Of course a person has access to judicial review and can challenge a decision. A person has three months to challenge any administrative action, but we need to get real here. A judicial review is carried out exclusively in the High Court by way of affidavit. It is incredibly expensive. To bring about a judicial review of a closure for a day would mean that a publican would have to spend tens of thousands of euro in legal fees. With the greatest of respect, I would have thought the High Court has more to be doing than examining the appropriateness or otherwise of closing a bar for a day. Obviously, closing a bar for a long time amounts to deprivation of livelihood, but closing a bar for a day is something that I hope is not being proposed for the High Court to examine the rights and wrongs of through judicial review.

I am very much in agreement with Deputy Howlin and I am minded to support his amendment.

Of course, I have an open mind as to what the Minister will say on how, if a publican is closed for a day, they can subsequently challenge that without going to court or without starting legal proceedings. What legal proceedings can be taken? If it is not a judicial review, then what is it? If a person does not challenge something at the time, it is taken to be valid, which is an invidious position. If a publican is closed for a day and comes back six months, nine months or a year later to renew their licence, and the local sergeant is asked if there are any objections, the sergeant might say he wishes to bring to the court's attention that this pub was closed for a day back on St. Patrick's Day. The publican could then say they do not accept it was right to be closed for a day but that a garda told them to close for a day and, of course, they adhered to a direction of a member of An Garda Síochána. What avenue does the publican have to challenge this? If the Minister is saying there is no avenue to challenge this other than a judicial review, which, as I said, is utterly unworkable in terms of the reality of the caseload of the High Court and the cost of judicial review, it means Deputy Howlin's amendment is imperative so there can be justice. It is one of the most basic principles of justice that people can challenge a State decision in respect of them if they do not agree it is correctly taken.

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