Mattie McGrath (Tipperary, Independent) | Oireachtas source

I am really disappointed with the Minister. I defer to Deputy Howlin, who has had a long service in the House and, as a Minister in a number of Governments, was in that seat putting through legislation and dealing with the Teachtaí Dála who wanted to make amendments or whatever. He is dead right. We are down to a matter of two words. On Sunday, I heard a representative of an organisation - I cannot remember which one it was - questioning the uncertainty and the unclear guidelines under which gardaí must operate in the context of Covid-19. We all support, salute and compliment the Garda, including in Tipperary and elsewhere where I have engaged with it. It has been great and it has been a great revisiting of the community spirit, community alert and support for the Garda. It has been great, despite all the bad aspects of Covid, that the Garda has done well, which gives an element of hope for the future of the Garda.

This is putting gardaí in an invidious position, as the representative in question noted as well. I also heard her say that some of the penal provisions were civil matters. My understanding is that they cannot be and that the Garda has no power to make directions in that regard or to do anything with them. I understand that a civil matter is something between the Ceann Comhairle and me, for example, where we take on our own cases. There is utter confusion. I cannot understand the obstinance of the Minister today - no disrespect to her personally - in refusing to remove these two words at the request of Deputies who have supported her legislation. I have not supported the legislation and I will not do so, but Deputy Howlin and his party have, with reservations, as he has stated. I listened to his Second Stage contribution yesterday and I acknowledge his experience.

He knows, as do I, that we are playing with words and semantics here, but these are generations of families in self-employed business who have never asked the State for a penny, who comply with the Licensing Acts every year and get their licences renewed because of the way they run their businesses, who provide employment and pay rates, tax, wages and insurance, and who support everything that goes on in the communities. In many communities the last bastion is the pub because everything else is gone. Funerals, tragedies, celebrations, christenings and parties are held in the public house, and publicans make their places available, warm and with comfortable surroundings in a safe and managed environment, which they have to do to secure a licence but they want to do it anyway. We are using a sledgehammer to crack a nut. If the Minister had-----

See this speech in context