Christopher O'Sullivan (Cork South West, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

My contribution should not come to more than six or seven minutes so that should work well enough.

I commend the Minister on bringing this Bill, which I will support, to the House. I also thank her for sticking around throughout the debate and listening to our contributions. This is my first opportunity to congratulate her on her new appointment. I am not sure whether the newly appointed Minister of State, Deputy James Browne, is still in the Chamber but I congratulate him as well.

This is an important Bill. As has been stated, the Minister will find that it meets with widespread support and compliance. The vast majority of publicans and restaurateurs are incredibly responsible, mature and law-abiding. That will be evident in the response to this legislation. Speaking about publicans' responsibility and trustworthiness brings me to the debate on pubs reopening. Pubs that do not serve food are still unable to reopen. I want to add to the voices, which seem to come from the majority of the Chamber, saying that this needs to change as soon as possible, with as much clarity and detail as possible.

I have thought about this matter carefully and while I am not a virologist or a public health expert, I fully believe that the best course of action is to listen to the guidance and suggestions of public health experts. Doing so has served us well so far. The Taoiseach said this morning that countries that have followed public health advice have fared best in controlling this virus. One sees a cycle at the moment whereby NPHET gives public health advice, the Government implements that advice and then the Government comes in for a lot of criticism. That is simply the way of the world. It reflects the frustration felt by people on the ground. When they are explained by NPHET or the relevant Ministers, most of the measures that have been taken, even the recent measures which imposed further restrictions on certain parts of society, make sense. However, I must admit that I am struggling to make sense of the continued closure of pubs that do not serve food.

I will give an example of what I mean by that. The recent measures imposed a limit on the number of people who could attend outdoor sporting events such as GAA, soccer or rugby fixtures. That raised eyebrows and as a sports fan I found it difficult to accept at the outset. However, within a day we received a very clear explanation. There had been a series of clusters associated with sporting events. That made sense. Similarly, eyebrows were raised by the exemption of places of worship from these new restrictions but an explanation followed very shortly. There were not that many clusters associated with places of worship. Following this, the argument that theatres should benefit from the same exemption was listened to and accepted. Common sense prevailed because there had been no clusters associated with theatres.

That is why I am struggling to see the difference between pubs that serve food and pubs that do not. I know the Government looks to international experience to justify this but that experience pertains to big cities and areas of high population density. That is not comparable to the situation here, particularly in areas of rural Ireland such as Cork South-West, which I represent. Most countries within Europe have now allowed pubs that do not serve food to open. It is high time that we followed suit.

The continued closure of pubs that do not serve food might have been more palatable if we listened to the concerns of publicans and offered supports that were robust and substantial enough to support them through these tough times. Unfortunately that did not happen. The measures and supports that have recently been announced fall short of what is needed to get publicans through this incredibly difficult time in their lives. A lot of publicans have already spent large amounts of money in the expectation that pubs would reopen. On two occasions they expected to reopen but found with just two or three days' notice that they could not. They have already invested in reopening their pubs but months later they are in the same situation. That reaffirms the point that we need properly robust and substantial supports.

There is a real and undeniable difference between rural and urban pubs. In small rural pubs one does not see the situations that were alluded to where people fight one another to get to the bar. That simply does not happen. The only similarity I can see between Copper Face Jacks and my local in Reenascreena is that they are both national institutions. They are completely different kettles of fish. The atmosphere and set-up are different. The local pub in Reenascreena is quite a safe place. That is the difference.

I am conscious of the fact that I am sharing time so I will try to finish up. I recently met my local publicans and vintners. They were frustrated. It is not just publicans who are lobbying for the reopening of pubs. The elderly population and those living in rural parts of Ireland also feel that this is an incredibly important measure for public health and mental health. As many Deputies have said, it is some people's only social outlet.

Publicans are frustrated. It was incredibly hard for me to explain why meat factories, where there have been significant outbreaks of the disease, were allowed to remain open while they were not given a chance to prove they could run their premises responsibly. They had some very clear messages. They need proper support and as I have said this has not happened yet. They need clear guidelines on how to operate, particularly with the new legislation we are introducing. Even gastropubs need much clearer guidelines. I will finish by saying that more than anything else, they need us to trust them.

They need us to see them as responsible citizens who have the ability, responsibility, skills and years of experience to run their premises in a safe, regulated and controlled manner. All they are asking for is that we trust them and that is what we should do.

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