Dáil debates

Wednesday, 10 June 2020

Climate Action and Low Carbon Development: Statements (Resumed)

 

7:35 pm

Photo of Damien EnglishDamien English (Meath West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank Deputy Durkan for his positive comments on the progress made by the Government on housing developments and the importance of whoever is in the next Government to continue to build on that success over the past couple of years.

We all say there is no doubt there were not enough houses built in the past couple of years. That is what Deputy Durkan is saying. There are still not enough. There are still problems out there. I am glad the majority in here are committing to adding to the social housing stock. I totally agree with the Deputy that, whoever is in government, central to that delivery of housing are the local authorities. In most cases, they are in charge. They will have the funding to deliver whatever housing they want to. They have targets set for each individual county. Thankfully, Cork, which was referenced earlier on, is one of the leading counties in housing delivery over the past couple of years. There are major improvements there. Likewise, Kildare and many others have a lot of opportunity here. The resources are there for them to bring forward more housing and they are doing that. They will build on that and they are to do more of that.

I do not agree with Deputy Durkan about the housing bodies' role. I think the housing bodies have a very important role to supplement the delivery of local authorities. I understand the experience in Kildare was a lot of housing associations as well as the larger housing bodies over the years and it is a difference of opinion there. The housing bodies in the past couple of years have been doing a very good job bringing a supply of housing. They work with the local authorities. Local authorities are central to this. For years, it has been Deputy Durkan's point that they should be and they are. It should be direct build as much as possible where they can, but when it comes to vacant stock, they should get in there very early.

I do not agree with Deputy Ward that local authorities have not got the powers to compulsorily purchase order, CPO, properties. They might have told the Deputy they could not, they did not want to or whatever at the time. I agree with the Deputy that local authorities should step in if need be and ideally use the carrot. We have had schemes, that have been referenced here and criticised, that have not worked to their full potential but they were good schemes put forward to incentivise the providers to let us use their housing and bring vacant stock into use. They did not avail of them. We need to update the schemes, change the schemes and increase the use of CPO or other powers to bring vacant houses back into stock.

Deputy Durkan made the point about the importance of dealing with the different income levels. The Deputy is absolutely right. Naturally, the majority of phase 1 of Rebuilding Ireland, over the past three or four years, involved social housing. We are now at a stage where we are delivering over 10,000 social houses a year. We are committed as a party - I hope others here are too - to bring that to 12,000 social houses in the years ahead. Not every party is, by the way. On top of that, we need to have thousands of affordable houses which will deal with the next income bracket, which Deputy Durkan consistently raises here. Deputy Durkan is correct. I hope whoever is in government next will deal with that affordable housing and the different income levels which are not being addressed and at present are shut out of the market.

I agree with the Deputy that in some areas house prices are too dear. We would all like cheaper housing but there is a cost to building a house. What we need to achieve is to get the market price closer to the cost of building a house whatever part of the country it is and that is the point the Deputy is making. That gap in between in some places is too high. Certainly we know with all the quality of houses that are built now under the regulations we have and the NZEB regulations, there is a cost of a house and it is something more than what it was years ago. However, one is buying a better house in most cases. That is what we should encourage. We try to do that with our social housing stock - high quality design and high quality build. However, it has to be affordable to the market as well and that is what it is trying to do.

I thank Deputy Durkan for his recognition of the work but also his constant championing of the cause, here and everywhere else, to do more.

I challenge every Deputy, as I have on many occasions, to step up on this. Not every party's manifesto reflected the need to put more money into housing, both social and private. I hope we will get a Government of like-minded people that will drive on with new housing delivery.

Local authorities have to have money to build housing. Deputy Gould mentioned his wisdom in 2009, 2010 and 2011, and there is a man on our left with the same wisdom, about the need to build more houses. We all recognise the need to do it but, sadly, at that time there was no money to do it. I am sure that when Deputy Durkan put forward the suggestions to develop sites, he probably had solutions for the money required. I do not know whether he did.

Nevertheless, I do not disagree with the Deputy. We needed to build houses, as was recognised by many. On my first trip to Cork as a Minister of State with responsibility for housing, I looked at the same sites and asked the same question as the Deputy, namely, why not use that site and let us drive on with it? While Cork has made major progress, the money was not there. I wish it had been there in my early years as a Government Deputy and Minister of State in the period 2011 to 2015, inclusive, but it was not. As soon as it became available, in the period 2016 to 2020, inclusive, we put it into housing, with a massive multi-billion euro spend that delivered those houses. It is not enough, however, and we need more. Cork, Kildare, Meath and everywhere else have to step up and do even more. I am hopeful that in the years ahead, we can deal with this housing issue once and for all but it will mean spending money on houses. I fully agree with the Deputy that local authority housing is the key in that regard, as are vacant homes.

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