Jim O'Callaghan (Dublin Bay South, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

As the Minister of State indicated, the purpose of the Bill is to transpose into Irish law two decisions, one of which is a framework decision and the other a Council decision from 2009. Fianna Fáil will support the Bill.

It is important to point out that the decisions we seek to transpose are of some antiquity. The comments I will make are not a criticism of the Department of Justice and Equality, but it would be remiss of us if we did not reflect on the fact that it has taken us ten years to start to transpose these decisions into Irish law. Such is the antiquity of these decisions, as with the framework decision, that we no longer have framework decisions as they were finished as a result of the Lisbon treaty.

Both decisions seek to regulate the exchange of information around criminal records within European Union member states. Both of the decisions are very beneficial and of use to the Irish criminal justice system and to the co-operation that goes on between EU member states.

Although the decisions were made ten years ago, in fairness to the former Minister, Alan Shatter, he announced in 2012 that legislation was being prepared to transpose the decisions in to Irish law. It was seven and a half years ago when Alan Shatter announced that the legislation was being prepared, but it is only being introduced in the Dáil today. I suspect that part of the reason it is being introduced now is that, unfortunately, in 2018 the European Commission had to send a warning letter to Ireland saying it was in breach of its obligations around the transposition of these decisions, and that it needed to hurry up and do it. I welcome the fact they are now being transposed but we need to reflect on the fact that in respect of the many decisions and directives that we need to transpose into Irish law, there is huge delay on the part of the State. This is not a criticism of any individual Department. In fairness to the Department of Justice and Equality, it has to deal with a huge amount of legislation. Even though we do not adopt all the justice issues that emanate from the European Union, much law comes through the criminal justice brief, which requires us to transpose decisions into Irish law. We need to reflect on our delay and try to get a system in place to speed it up.

As the Minister of State, Deputy Stanton, said, the purpose of the Bill is to try to introduce co-operation with the exchange of information about criminal records. The Minister of State referred to the European criminal records information system, ECRIS. Part of the reason there has not been huge urgency in bringing legislation like this forward is that since 2012 An Garda Síochána has applied ECRIS and has used it, to all intents and purposes, the way it will be used after this legislation is enacted. On one level, Ireland was not at a huge disadvantage as a result of the non-transposition of these decisions. As an earlier debate in the Chamber has taught us, we have to be very careful about the State engaging in any administrative action or any Executive power when it does not have a legal basis for doing so. The Government got into difficulty with the public services card, PSC, in seeking access to details on the card from citizens when accessing other services such as passports. The Data Protection Commissioner stated her opinion recently that this was an unlawful use of the public services card because there was no legal basis on which it was required. Similarly, we have to be careful about exchanging information about criminal records when we do not have a legal basis to do so. I welcome that this will be rectified when the legislation is enacted. I am not suggesting there would be legitimate legal challenge to the system operable at present but the State must be careful to ensure it always has a legal basis for carrying out State actions.

As I said, ECRIS is currently operated by An Garda Síochána and the Garda national vetting bureau acts as the designated central authority for criminal records in Ireland. Under the proposed legislation this function will pass to the Garda Commissioner and he or she can delegate it to another section within An Garda Síochána.

The purpose of ECRIS is that the Garda can make requests of the central authorities in other EU member states to find out information about citizens or persons from other member states to see whether they have a criminal record. Requests can be made to Ireland from central authorities in other member states asking for information, probably about Irish citizens or people who have been resident here, to determine whether they have a criminal record. We store much information on people who have committed criminal offences. It is important we do so, especially in respect of the more serious criminal offences.

The issue as to the purpose of a criminal record arises. Criminal records can be a huge disadvantage to people who accumulate them when they are younger, as the Acting Chairman is aware from his work. Many people come to us as Deputies when applying for a job with the State or a job in the private sector and they are required to give details of any criminal record they have. It can be very debilitating for them because although they may have completely rehabilitated themselves, it can act as a serious deterrent to employers and others when they find out the person they are about to hire, or to use for another sensitive purpose, has previously engaged in a criminal act and has a criminal record. This is why it is important that we seek to develop our law on spent convictions. I do not believe somebody who has rehabilitated himself or herself and has reformed his or her life should live permanently under the shadow of a criminal conviction he or she obtained when he or she was young and in circumstances from whence he or she has long since departed.

There is, however, a benefit to criminal records that arises at two stages, namely, when police authorities are investigating a crime and when it comes to a court imposing a sentence on a person who has been convicted of a crime. With the former, obviously if there is an ongoing investigation in another EU country of an Irish citizen, and that citizen suspected of a criminal offence, it would be of benefit to the police authorities in that European Union country to know whether the individual has a previous criminal conviction for a similar offence. It does not mean that because a person has a previous criminal conviction, he or she is responsible for the subsequent similar offence being investigated, but it is of benefit to a police authority and investigator to know that a person has previously committed a similar offence. When a case comes to trial, and certainly in Ireland, one would not be able to reveal to a jury or a court that a person had previously committed a criminal offence similar to the one with which he or she was being charged. That would be unfair and it would prejudice a jury and would affect the judge in the assessment of whether the person had committed the offence under investigation. Criminal records are of benefit when it comes to the sentencing. If the person has a string of previous convictions in another country, then it will be of benefit to the other EU country to know the person has other convictions. It indicates a propensity to commit these offences. This is taken into account when a court comes to sentence the person.

There is huge benefit in co-operation between member states around the exchange of information about criminal records. It serves a public purpose and Ireland should be involved in this. Also relevant is the issue of what is going to happen when Brexit arises. Unquestionably, when one looks at the statistics, one can see that the United Kingdom seeks a huge amount of information from other member states in respect of offences committed in the UK. The UK also provides a considerable amount of information to other member states on UK citizens or residents who have committed, or may have committed, offences in other EU member states.

Another issue of concern to us all in the context of Brexit is what will happen when the United Kingdom is no longer part of the ECRIS system. Concerns have been expressed as to the future position of the UK, particularly because, at present, only EU member states are permitted access to ECRIS. Even the non-EU Schengen countries are excluded. In 2018, the then UK Home Secretary, Sajid Javid, suggested that the UK should seek to continue its strong stance of co-operation with the EU in regard to matters relating to counter-terrorism and security. One wonders how he would get on if he stood up this evening in the House of Commons and suggested that the UK continue its strong stance of co-operation with the EU regarding certain matters. He would get a negative response, especially from members of the Tory Party. We need to recognise that there will be a gap, particularly if the UK leaves the EU on 31 October without a deal. We will have to prepare for that. It is another example of how this State and the United Kingdom will suffer as a result of a no-deal Brexit.

As stated, Fianna Fáil supports the legislation. It is important that we share information relating to criminal records with other members states. We also need to continue to update our legislation in respect of spent convictions and to recognise that people can be rehabilitated. Unfortunately, the statistics revealed yesterday by the Central Statistics Office show a very high rate of recidivism, particularly among young men. It appears that 50% of men in their 20s reoffend within three years of leaving prison. This is a significant problem. It shows that if young men become involved in crime at an early age, it is difficult to get them out of it before the age of 40. Research shows that once they reach 40 years of age, men stop committing crime. The recidivism rate drops considerably. Unfortunately, if a young boy of 14 or 15 years gets involved in minor criminal activity, it is difficult to get him off that pathway and the likelihood is that he will end up in prison. If he ends up in prison once, there is a significant chance he will return to prison. This should encourage us to do all we can to deter young men from getting involved in criminal activity at an early age. To achieve this, we need to ensure that there is greater educational attainment among these young men and we need to direct them down other avenues such as sport and vocations so that they feel a sense of worth and do not feel it necessary to get involved in crime.

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