Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Deputies who participated in the debate. I particularly thank Deputy Stanley for bringing this Bill forward. As the Minister of State, Deputy Phelan, said, the Government will not oppose the Bill. Indeed, we need a legal framework for microgeneration and we must promote its expansion. It is undoubtedly an important opportunity for people to participate in reducing their reliance on bought-in energy, and it promotes a culture of reliance on renewable energy, which is very important.

The EU has imposed an obligation on Ireland to achieve 32% use of renewables across the entire energy system by 2020. We will achieve a 40% target in respect of power but we will not achieve the target in other areas such as transport. We will fall short in those areas so we must improve in them. As many Deputies have indicated, we are facing a crisis in that we are way off target in respect of the carbon commitments we have made. Quite apart from the fact that we have made legally binding commitments, the approach we take is a huge responsibility for the country and community. We have had to focus urgently on the expansion of renewable energy, and the renewal energy support scheme is the vehicle for that. We have an ambition to go from 40% renewable to 55% renewable by 2030. That will represent a substantial expansion in our renewable capacity.

In the context of examining that target, microgeneration was seriously examined by the Department to see if it could make a contribution and whether it could be part of the scheme. However, it did not have the capacity to deliver quickly on a large scale to meet the target we have in mind. It is more expensive and would be much slower to achieve. Instead of seeking to make it part of the broad renewable support scheme, where it would be competing with large wind and solar farms, the Department has introduced a special scheme for microgeneration. It represents significant subsidies for microgeneration. A solar PV gets €700 per kilowatt it puts in. Solar plus battery is larger scale and can draw down more subsidy. A battery energy system gets €1,000 per kilowatt. Significant support is being provided for microgeneration. In addition, there is significant interest based on the figures we have seen to date. Approximately 5,000 applicants per annum will come into the scheme and it will run until 2020. We will review the scheme early next year to examine the possibility of expanding it to other technologies or to other groups of people. As a number of Deputies said, that would be worthwhile. The scheme could be very successful and make a significant contribution to getting people to engage on this.

Microgeneration is a good micro business because in some cases it can be 100% effective where there is a battery for storage. It can pay for itself in approximately eight years. Even without support it has a good payback period. It also offers the opportunity to sell back into the grid. Under EU commitments we must deliver a legal framework under which microgenerators can sell back to the grid. I fully support that objective. It was adopted by the Citizens' Assembly and by Deputy Stanley in his Bill. The issue is the best mechanism to deliver it. Different models have been used in different markets. Some use what is called a net market price whereby when a person needs electricity, he or she buys it, and when that person has a surplus, he or she sells it and pays on the net flow. That is one way of doing it in a number of countries. Others do it by way of having a market price, as the Citizens' Assembly suggests. A price is set as the wholesale price. We must tease out which is the best option to choose.

One of my misgivings with the Bill is that Deputy Stanley has not looked at what the costs will be and on whom they will fall. With any legislation we must consider what would technically be called a regulatory impact assessment: who is being asked to carry the obligation, what it will cost and if it is the least costly way of achieving it. We must work through that by consultation with those who will be involved and by looking at the pilot scheme to see what lessons can be learned from it and what lessons can be learned from other countries. The Deputy has referred to other countries we should look at in considering how we should roll this out.

Some misgivings must be also be expressed about the fact that the Deputy has chosen to provide for a minimum supply of 5% for some electricity suppliers but not others. That 5% appears quite high and the Deputy is making it a legal obligation to have that much microgeneration within a very short time. As to whether that is a realistic or deliverable target, while I am just a month in this job, from what I have learned it does not appear that microgeneration can hit such a target. We will deliver 15% extra renewables by 2030 through a significant scheme which will require some level of support. I doubt that microgeneration could deliver the target the Deputy outlines, so it would potentially be a very big obligation if it became law and was enforceable. It would be a difficult and high-cost way of achieving what we all seek. There are questions in that regard which have to be teased out.

One aspect of what the Deputy is proposing that I like, and other speakers have spoken about this, is the importance of getting community commitment and partnership in the efforts to develop renewable energy. We will not succeed in confronting the climate challenge if we cannot get community commitment. Some of these things will be very unpopular. We have spoken in the House about the need for a trajectory for carbon price. Carbon is what economists call a negative externality. We are doing damage to our environment and we are not paying for it. That is why a carbon price will have to be considered as part of this. It cannot all be Government schemes for subsidising people. There will also be difficult decisions. As Deputy Bríd Smith said, we will have to change our lifestyles. It is a big change and will not be easy to do, so it is important to have a sense of community partnership.

One success has been the community initiative for energy efficiency. It is a very successful scheme supported by the Sustainable Energy Authority of Ireland, SEAI. It has achieved a lot of community involvement and has delivered improvements. The Deputy has not only spoken about it but he visited a scheme today. I saw him on the television visiting Tipperary where improvements in schools and in individual homes have been part of a very good scheme. The renewable energy support scheme will have a community support framework built into it, so the larger-scale projects we need to deliver the targets we have committed to will be a part of that. We also must ensure, and this is the underlying principle of the Bill, that microgeneration can be a part of that framework and can have a legal basis on which to enter the framework. We will have to transpose a more detailed EU directive into Irish law, so by no means am I seeking to put off, delay or scupper legislation in this area.

We are committed to delivering legislation in this area, but I need to ensure that whatever legislation we bring in is the most cost-effective in terms of community engagement, that it is effective in meeting our obligations, and that it is effective in meeting the challenge of climate change.

I thank the Deputies for their interest. I have taken on this post and it is not something I had a great deal of familiarity with up to one month ago. I see there is a huge challenge for all of us in the House. It is not going to be a question of just picking the nice things we want to do. There are also difficult aspects in this area. I look forward to the support of the House and especially of the committee, which is sitting until the end of January, in this challenge. I look forward to working with the House to try to come up with proposals that we can all get in behind.

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