John Paul Phelan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I accept that Deputy Fitzmaurice did not say it. There are many councillors who have not fully made up their minds. Funding is a key issue. I have no difficulty in talking to Deputies Connolly and Grealish and others about retaining the position of mayor of Galway. The position dates back to the 1400s and there is a symbolic importance to it. This is more than just a ceremonial position. I have no difficulty in considering that matter further.

The first step in the Galway merger process will be the issue of funding. Discussions are already taking place between the Galway local authorities and officials in the Department in respect of additional funding. All the comparators were referred to and I have never disputed them. Part of the issue is that Galway City Council is a relatively new entity. It was established in 1985 as a separate corporate local authority from Galway County Council. Many people I know in Galway feel that the city council never really took off fully independently of the county council. The Minister of State, Deputy Kyne, spoke at length about the fact Galway city has done well, even in the recessionary years. Part of Galway city’s periphery and some of the substantial market towns in the county have not done so well, however. That is a reason why a unitary authority in Galway would work. We have significant rates bases in and around the city while many of those market towns in the county have lost traditional shops. Deputy Michael Collins named shops in west Cork which have closed in recent weeks. That has been the case in many regional towns, not least in Galway. A united local authority, which can look at where development is happening in Galway, which is mostly around the city and its hinterland, can then use some of those resources to help some of those towns which are struggling.

Deputy Connolly referred to how large a geographical area - from the Gaeltacht to Gort - the merged council would have to cover. The county council already covers that area with the exception of the city. It will be the third or fourth largest local authority in the country.

Deputy Ó Cuív gave a most interesting and lengthy contribution - it was different from what I expected it to be - which was mostly about football, parishes and things of that nature. He was a bit "Trumpian" and decried experts. Several times in his contribution he denounced that we should ever consider having experts and that nobody was consulted. The Oireachtas Members in Galway were consulted on at least one occasion, if not more, by the expert group. Most of the expert group were Galway natives. I do not believe local democracy, whether it is Galway city or county councils or Cork city or county councils, is the preserve of councillors. It belongs to the people. By all means, consult councillors too. However, the notion that unless councillors give their consent then it is null and void does not stand up to much scrutiny.

Several Deputies referred to officials operating in acting capacities in Galway local authorities. From the Department's point of view, there is no bar on those positions being filled permanently. That matter will have to be raised by Deputies.

That is all the more reason a renewed management system, as envisaged in the section that deals with the appointment of a new joint chief executive, would be a good thing in a Galway context. That said, I am perfectly willing to consider amendments and suggestions from Members. However, I do not accept Deputy Grealish's assertion that this is disingenuous or Deputy Ó Cuív's claim that it is devious. There is nothing devious about it. This has been going on for four or five years in some way, shape or form. The methodology for implementing it is exactly the same as that employed in Limerick, Tipperary and Waterford. Deputy Jan O'Sullivan has spoken about the fact that Limerick city and county have benefited enormously from the merger of its city and county councils. Waterford has been much slower to benefit but improvements are happening. I live approximately half a mile from the centre of Waterford city and have seen it coming back to life in recent years. The merger has played its part in that.

As an outsider, it strikes me that the issue in Galway is that the city has done well in the past and continues to do well, relative to the county. Deputy Ó Cuív referred to how the centre will always take power and resources and that he is against centralisation for that reason. That is King Canute stuff. Galway city is taking money already. It is attracting shoppers, visitors and others, to the detriment of the rest of the county. To suggest that we can go back in time is a nonsense. Deputy McGuinness and others spoke about a golden age of local government but I was a councillor 20 years ago and there was never a golden age, to my knowledge. I accept that councils have lost powers but I have referred to the job being done by Sara Moorhead on the question of giving more functions and powers to councillors and councils. We can often view the past through rose tinted glasses. Deputy McGuinness wants me to re-establish Kilkenny city council, for example, but there was never a city council in Kilkenny. There was a Kilkenny corporation and a Kilkenny borough council but there was never a city council. It is interesting that Deputy McGuinness failed to mention a proposal to the boundary commission for the most recent local elections to divide Kilkenny city that was a carbon copy of a submission by Fianna Fáil. No other political party or individual devised a situation whereby Kilkenny city would be cut down the middle. I do not know if the Fianna Fáil submission was made by Deputy Aylward or Deputy McGuinness but I will not take lectures from the latter about Kilkenny city. Deputy McGuinness also said something extraordinary. He referred to a major division between Kilkenny city and county, but there is no such division. In fact, I would say that there is less division now than at any time in the past.

Deputies Michael McGrath, Fitzmaurice and others spoke about the structure of the municipal districts. I would envisage that the municipal districts will grow in the future and gain their own independence. It is a new system and it is interesting to note that councillors who are members of municipal districts favour the system-----

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