Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I am pleased to have an opportunity to speak on the Bill. Along with other Members I happen to be one of the people who sat in committee for the final quarter of last year discussing this particular issue. There was a general recognition that there was an evolution of thinking in the course of the examination of the witnesses and their submissions to the committee hearings. I have the height of respect for everyone. Like most of the committee members I would not be in any way a strong supporter of abortion, as such. The definition of abortion is the deliberate intervention, the object of which is to terminate the life of the baby that is yet to be born. There are other interventions that may not do that at all. That is why some of us went to great pains to ensure that the three-day waiting period was observed. I strongly support that on the basis that two of the delegations that presented in the course of the committee hearings pointed out the fact that in the first instance when a girl or a woman found herself pregnant, possibly with a crisis pregnancy, she needed support, counselling and help and to be able to rely on some person in whom she could confide to give her advice. They also explained to us that in some cases the person changed her mind and that her first decision, whether it was for or against might not necessarily be the course of action she decided to follow. I believe that is correct and that we need to recognise the situation such a woman might find herself in and to provide for such cases.

We also learnt something equally important, namely, the necessity for proper sex education in schools and the need to ensure that it is comprehensively imparted to the new generation so that young people, both men and women, are conscious of the consequences of certain activities but more important, that they are in a position to be able to know in certain circumstances what is in their interests, and in particular in the interests of their health and what to do and what not to do.

Late stage abortions have been mentioned in recent days as something that was not previously discussed. In fact, it was, and socio-economic reasons were put forward as a reason for having an abortion. The committee rejected that at the time.

I believe it did so on good grounds and I believe it was the right thing to do. I stand over that and the Bill reflects that as well.

Much has been said about Down's syndrome and the need to ensure that those with Down's syndrome are not victimised in the course of the enactment of the legislation. In fact, the committee went to great lengths to ensure that the existence of Down's syndrome was not going to be a precondition for having an abortion, and rightly so.

We made several other changes in the course of the hearings. For one thing, we had to recognise the facts. The fact is that young women and not-so-young women in some circumstances have found themselves in a panic situation with nowhere to go and no advice to draw on. It may be only be a matter for themselves and the situation may be fast evolving. They may not have much time to act. What is the right thing to do? The legislation now before the House best reflects the thinking during the course of the submissions we heard in the committee. That is as it should be. I do not believe we should deviate from it at all. We should incorporate within the legislation the sentiments expressed before the committee and we are doing that. These sentiments were subsequently reflected in the heads published before the referendum. My reason for saying this is because we voted on it. The people voted on the heads that were presented before the referendum and I believe we have an obligation to ensure that is the way it stands.

I recognise that people have a right to conscientious objection. That needs to be provided for, but it should not be as a result of any diminution in the rights of women to get the services that are required at any particular time. We spent considerable time in the committee discussing that particular issue. I have dealt with situations - I imagine everyone else in the House has too - and read about situations of a nature that raised serious questions about the extent to which women's rights and entitlements to health and life were not necessarily observed. There are certain conditions that a woman can have ordinarily. During the course of a pregnancy these conditions may accelerate rapidly to the extent that, at a certain point, her health and, rapidly thereafter, her life will be in danger. We have had several illustrations of this in recent years. That is unacceptable and we must legislate for it. There have been situations in which the threat to the health and life of women, who may well have had existing families, might have been ignored and that is not acceptable.

We accept the right to conscientious objection among the medical profession, whether it be pharmacists, doctors, nurses or whatever the case may be, but there must be referral to someone who will deal with the situation insofar as the woman is concerned. She should not be deprived of obtaining the services she requires. There may be a medical requirement at that stage. I am strongly of the opinion that we need to be absolutely certain that her life is not put in jeopardy as a result of that kind of situation. There are plenty of ways and means of dealing with the situation if it should come to pass that the legislation was flawed, if provisions did not work or if someone at some stage later on were to say that if the rule of law applied the woman would have been treated differently.

It is generally recognised and has been said over and over again that this is the safest country in the world for a woman to give birth. There are numerous reasons for accepting or believing that. However, I wish to point out that increasing numbers of court cases arise from situations where women are aggrieved after treatment and sometimes pass away after treatment. In such cases they, or their families, have been concerned about the way they have been treated. We could all say this is because of the litigious society we live in. That may well be but it is not true to say that there is no risk involved. I accept, and everyone else realises, that women have been having babies for millions of years, generally without any problem. However, significant numbers of situations can arise from time to time in which the woman has no control over what is happening. In such situations her health can rapidly deteriorate to such an extent that she has no chance of living. That has arisen in a number of situations in recent years and that is not acceptable.

I mentioned the question of the need for proper sex education in schools and elsewhere in primary and secondary level. However, I did not go into the details of birth control in the first instance. I do not believe that abortion should be a form of birth control but I believe that the way some women were treated raises questions. I do not propose to go into these cases in detail tonight but the way some women were treated during the past 150 years, and especially during our lifetime, was simply appalling. This applied especially to pregnant women who were banished from society and cast out into exterior darkness. The nuns were subsequently blamed for what happened in the Tuam Bon Secours Mother and Baby Home and various other mother and baby homes throughout the country. The nuns were blamed but in actual fact it was society that did not live up to its expectations. Society opted out and did not want to know about it. We now review the situation in the light of hindsight and we say that it should not have happened. That is right: it should not have happened. It was disgraceful carry-on, just as it would be in any country. This did not only happen in this country; it arose in several other jurisdictions as well. It was an old-fashioned way of responding to a crisis pregnancy. I hope that we have sufficiently developed and evolved to ensure that we do not have repetition of that. I hope that when this legislation is passed it will cater for the kind of situations that we have seen previously in which women did not receive the kind of treatment they should have received.

I want to finish by simply saying one thing. This legislation has come after an extraordinary response from the public who voted. They voted clearly in the knowledge that they wanted some things to change. That is as it should be. Society will eventually recognise that what is being done now is the right thing, that it is fair and that it does not go overboard to the extent applicable to our next-door neighbours, where there is abortion on demand. This is not abortion on demand. There are restrictions such that it does not happen. Advice is available to women in the first instance and hence the three-day waiting period. That will be of considerable benefit to the general extent of our health services. It will be of considerable reassurance to the women of the country. It will create a clear impression in the minds of women, young or old, who may be pregnant in a particular situation. They will know that they can rely on the support services available, go forward into the maternity hospital or go for counselling. They will know that they will be protected, that their interests will be borne in mind and that they will be protected throughout.

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