Mattie McGrath (Tipperary, Independent) | Oireachtas source

I, too, am delighted to speak to this motion tonight on behalf of the Rural Independent Group. I compliment Deputies Daly and Wallace on tabling this important motion for debate in the House. We have had little or no debate on this issue or the issue of genocide in the Middle East despite many requests. I also compliment the Deputies on going out and spending their time there and seeing it first hand. I intend to travel there myself. I did travel to Lebanon but I have never been to Syria.

The devastation and the carnage that has been inflicted on the Syrian people over the course of recent years has caused untold misery. The Syrian civil war is now in its sixth year. It has been reported that more than 400,000 people have died, with more than 11 million people displaced from their homes, including 5 million registered refugees. It is an appalling crisis by any standard. The news agency Catholic World Report has said that civilian witnesses have given testimony to the carnage. Hospitals bombed, chlorine gas bombs unleashed and starvation are only some of the atrocities that have been inflicted. Families and entire communities have been destroyed. It will be at least a generation before some hope of any renewal can take place within Syria, and that is provided the war is stopped.

Add to that the extremely complex geopolitical problems and one would easily be forgiven for thinking no resolution is possible. However, we must never despair. That is not a position we can or must adopt. We have seen in our country, although admittedly on a much smaller scale, how an internal conflict can scar a nation and fundamentally change it. We still see the baggage of it in our present situation regarding Brexit. When it comes to debating sanctions as a political option, the main problem is always the same: will the sanctions help to resolve the situation or will they hinder it. I note that in May of this year the United States House of Representatives passed a Bill that issues additional sanctions against supporters of Syria's Assad regime and those providing arms for the regime. An old saying I used to hear from my late mother and father was, "Those who live in glasshouses should not throw stones". We could apply this saying to our Yankee friends in this case.

The American House passed the Caesar Syria Civilian Protection Act of 2017, issuing additional sanctions on the Assad regime and its backers, especially human rights violators and those involved in the trade of weapons or weapons parts with the regime, which, as clearly outlined by other Members tonight, is a vast industry. As I understand it, those supporters include Russia and Iran - international allies of Assad. As is to be expected, Christian leaders in the area have denounced the trafficking of weapons into Syria as something which helps the conflict continue. Pope Francis has repeatedly denounced the arms trade. In his September 2015 speech to the US Congress, Pope Francis emphasised that Christians must ask why deadly weapons are being sold to those who plan to inflict untold suffering on individuals and society. He stated:

Sadly, the answer, as we all know, is simply for money: money that is drenched in blood, often innocent blood. In the face of this shameful and culpable silence, it is our duty to confront the problem and to stop the arms trade.

Last July, in a video message promoting peace in Syria, he lamented that, while the people suffer, incredible quantities of money are being spent to supply weapons to fighters. He also noted that some of the arms suppliers are also among those that talk of peace.

The questions of sanctions is complex. I note that the Council on Foreign Relations states that Governments and multinational bodies impose economic sanctions to try to alter the strategic decisions of state and non-state actors which threaten their interests or violate international norms of behaviour. The council also notes that critics say sanctions are often poorly conceived and rarely successful in changing a target's conduct, while supporters contend that they have become more effective in recent years and remain an essential foreign policy tool. I have my serious doubts.

For example, sanctions have become the defining feature of the Western response to severe geopolitical challenges, including North Korea's nuclear programme and Russia's intervention in Ukraine. What must be uppermost in our minds, however, are the questions around who really suffers when it comes to sanctions. Again, the Council on Foreign Relations has observed that economic sanctions may be comprehensive by prohibiting commercial activity with regard to an entire country such as the long-standing US embargo of Cuba or they may be targeted by blocking transactions with particular business groups or individuals. Since 9/11 there has been what is termed a pronounced shift towards targeted or so-called smart sanctions which aim to minimise the suffering of innocent civilians. Perhaps if were to make more decisive interventions, however, the need for sanctions would have been eliminated or reduced.

When it comes to Syria, I want to conclude by noting the Christian Aid work of the Open Doors organisation. It has stated:

The overall situation in Syria is characterized by heavy persecution of all types of Christians in areas held by IS and other Islamic militants. Many Christians have already fled areas that are held by Islamic militants (including IS) or that were destroyed during the conflict.

Many Christians have already fled the areas held by Islamic militants, including ISIS, that were destroyed during the conflict. Deputies Wallace and Daly told us what is happening tonight. We know ourselves that an entire region has been wiped out. It is not only the Christians who are being persecuted. As Deputy Wallace alluded to, other sects are being persecuted also. Schools catering for multiple Islamic groups were targeted. Deputy Wallace listed the various Islamic tribes that have been targeted. Imagine targeting schoolchildren at 3 o'clock in the afternoon. A suicide bomber pulled up with a car and handed out sweets and crisps to hungry people. He lured them to the car and destroyed dozens of them, blowing them to pieces. Some 50 or 60 are still missing. No one knows where they are held in captivity. That is appalling.

We have had no debates here. It was interesting to learn tonight the position of the Government parties, Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil. With the new confidence and supply arrangement, the pipe has been mended and the water is flowing again. They two parties are together opposing this motion. We must question this and why we have had no debates here in this Chamber. I said this last week about the EU policy on our armies. We have had no debate. I have been seeking a debate on this matter for five or six years. Deputy Grealish, Senator Mullen and I visited Lebanon. Last Holy Thursday evening, thanks to the Ceann Comhairle, we had a double slot during the Topical Issue debate. That is the only way we could raise this. Tonight we would not be able to do so only that Deputies Wallace and Daly used their own time in which to table a motion. We must sit up and listen. Genocide is being carried out in Syria. We must not add our name to what is being done or have blood on our hands because of it.

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