Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

A question was asked about legacy issues. There are no amnesties from prosecution provided for in the Good Friday Agreement or any subsequent agreements, including the Stormont House Agreement. The Government has been clear that it would not look favourably on any proposal to introduce such a measure for State or non-State actors. Our position is and will remain that the rule of law, including the requirement under Article 2 of the European Convention on Human Rights for effective investigations of unlawful killings, must be upheld by all responsible authorities.

The Government will continue to engage with the British Government and the political parties to seek an urgent move forward on legacy issues by establishing the Stormont House framework in a manner that will meet the legitimate needs and expectations of all victims and survivors as well as contribute to the broader societal reconciliation as an integral part of the peace process. The legacy process should not be about seeking to find an artificial balance or equivalence in investigations but rather about ensuring that we have a comprehensive approach.

I was asked about the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference. As I informed the House yesterday, in my meeting with the UK Prime Minister, Mrs. May, and her team on Friday morning in Gothenburg, I indicated that we would seek a meeting of the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference in the new year should the DUP and Sinn Féin be unable to form an Executive before then. We did not agree a date for the meeting but it is fair to say that our request is in the context of an international agreement - the Good Friday Agreement or Belfast Agreement. I can see no reason it would be refused. It is simply going to be a case of setting a date.

The view the Government is taking, which I imagine everyone in the House will support, is that the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference deals with matters that are not devolved. If nothing is devolved, then the British-Irish Intergovernmental Conference, by definition, deals with all matters. That is the approach we are taking. Naturally, both governments would prefer if it was possible for the DUP and Sinn Féin to form an Executive. However, if that is not the case, then the governments will meet to implement the Good Friday Agreement in the absence of the political parties in Northern Ireland.

Reference was made to the relationship between the British and Irish Governments. Personal relations are very good. The Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Coveney, has had any number of meetings with other Ministers, including the UK Foreign Secretary, Mr. Johnson, recently. It was a long meeting. I have met and spoken to the UK Prime Minister, Mrs. May, probably on more occasions than I can count in what has only been a six-month period in office. At official level there is deep engagement all the time. Often this goes on behind the scenes with those involved trying to understand each other's positions. The difficulty is not so much one of relations or relationships but rather the enormous policy gap that now exists between a United Kingdom Government that wants to leave the European Union - it seems to be pursuing a hard Brexit policy by leaving the Single Market and customs union - and an Irish Government that accepts the decision the UK people have made but wants to protect our national interests, not only those relating to trade between Britain and Ireland but our national interests in respect of Northern Ireland as well.

We always explain in meetings that for many people in the European Union these talks might be about the financial settlement or economics, but for us it is about far more than that. Back 100 years ago our island was partitioned. We have spent the past 20 years trying to remove borders and bring people together in Northern Ireland as well as bringing Northern Ireland closer to Ireland while respecting the constitutional settlement. This is potentially a really major step backwards of historical significance. For us, this is about far more than trade, the economy and money. It is about far greater, deeper, bigger and historical issues. I think that is understood but I am surprised it was not understood from the outset by more people.

I agree absolutely with Deputy Martin that we need de-escalation of tensions in Catalonia. There should be no violence either from people calling for independence or from state actors. I agree with Deputy Martin's sentiment that a referendum in which only 38% of the electorate voted for independence should not be the final say on the matter. We need dialogue. I understand that elections are now planned. I hope those elections proceed as normal.

I wish to pick up on the questions from Deputies Burton and Howlin. We have a paper. It was published some months ago under the former Prime Minister, Deputy Kenny. We do not need to update it greatly because things have not moved on all that much from what was set out in that paper in terms of options, our priorities and the potential consequences.

We have also set out clearly our objectives, including the objective to retain the common travel area and all the associated rights, in particular rights of British and Irish citizens to live, work, study as well as access welfare, housing and education in both countries as though we were citizens of both. We want the Good Friday Agreement to be honoured and implemented. A mapping exercise has been done on all the different areas of North-South co-operation. We want funding to be retained for PEACE and INTERREG programmes. We are seeking a transition period in order that business, individuals and families can adapt to any permanent changes that may arise. We want a deep and comprehensive free trade agreement between the European Union and the United Kingdom in order that our farmers, businesses and exporters can continue to trade as they do now. We also want the commitments that we have been given on the Border from the UK Government to the effect that there will not be a hard border, that there will not be any physical infrastructure on the Border and that any border will be frictionless and seamless, to be written down in such a way that we know the parameters for the phase 2 discussion. The way I have explained it in media interviews with the British press and, more important, in my conversations with the British Prime Minister and her team is that we accept that the United Kingdom is leaving the European Union. That is a decision of the British people. However, the British Government has made a further decision to take the Single Market and the customs union off the table before we enter phase 2 talks on the new relationship. The British Government has taken a political decision to narrow the parameters for the talks on trade and the new relationship. We want the parameters narrowed as well. What we want is to have the parameters narrowed in such a way that assures us that we will not have a return to the borders of the past, to use that particular language. Again, that is set out in the European Commission task force paper in respect of how we believe that can be achieved. The text is in the final paragraph. We think it can be best achieved if the United Kingdom, either on behalf of all of the UK or on behalf of Northern Ireland, commits to regulatory equivalence, that is to say, that we will operate the same rules and regulations. Without doing that, it is almost impossible to avoid some form of hard border.

That is our position. It is the position not only of the Irish Government but of the EU 27. We are awaiting a response from the UK side, including an alternative proposal that we deem satisfactory. We have not received that yet.

I wish to pick up on the comments of Deputies Ryan and Howlin. I very much appreciate their words of support for the position the Government is taking. We could be into a difficult few weeks and months ahead. This is potentially a historic decision for us. I appreciate the fact that the Deputies are supporting the Government decision to hold firm on this. We have the absolute support of the other European Union member states that are remaining. We have not come under any pressure as yet to soften our position. However, I am not so naive as to think that that may not occur. We will avoid at any cost being isolated. However, even if we are isolated, we have to hold to this position, in my view.

I was asked about a meeting of the party leaders. I think that would be welcome as we reach decision points. Certainly, between now and the European Council on 14-15 December, that would be a very useful idea all around.

However, I want to be at a decision point, not just at a point of ten different hypothetical scenarios, which is a little bit where we are now. I chose ten is a random figure by the way so there is no need to raise a query or ask a question as to what the ten scenarios are.

On the OECD and the base erosion and profit shifting, BEPS, process, I do not know if the Crown dependencies are part of the OECD or BEPS process. I learned all about the Crown dependencies when I was in Jersey. They are not in the United Kingdom or the European Union but they voluntarily adopt all EU acquis and law. As a result, they have access to the Single Market. It is an interesting model.

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