Lisa Chambers (Mayo, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

It is a pity the Minister of State, Deputy Patrick O'Donovan, decided to exit the Chamber so quickly. He appeared to be confused in supporting a non-existent Government amendment. Perhaps his colleagues might inform him of same.

The suggestion the motion is somehow inconsistent with the White Paper needs to be considered in the light of the fact that the failures of the reorganisation in 2012 did not manifest until 2014. The Green Paper consultation process commenced in 2013. No consultation took place after this until the final consultation forum prior to publication of the White Paper in 2015. The current human resource failures and the financial resourcing inadequacies confirm the requirement to revisit the White Paper in the light of current circumstances where it has been clearly demonstrated that the Defence Forces are unable to meet the demands of the State.

During Leaders' Questions today the Taoiseach stated morale in the Defence Forces was high. Is he contradicting or contesting the findings of the University of Limerick climate survey conducted in 2016? The Minister of State knows from many discussions in this Chamber in the past year that morale is not high. In fact, it is quite low.

The Minister of State touched on the issue of recruitment and the retention of personnel. We have to acknowledge that the skills required in the Defence Forces need to be grown organically as we cannot recruit externally. We have to train people from scratch. This takes a considerable period of time and in the absence of a clear retention policy the Defence Forces are going to continue to haemorrhage personnel. The Minister of State has done nothing to show me or any other Deputy what the plan is to ensure retention. He is rumbling through and speaking about recruitment campaigns, which is fine. Last year's recruitment campaign actually resulted in a net loss of Defence Forces personnel. Defence Forces numbers are down again.

The White Paper is a soft strategy. Its real test is the operational results. Is it true that the White Paper project team had to redesign its approach after establishing that the Defence Forces could not meet the identified threat analysis?

The Minister of State mentioned the purchase of key equipment by his Department.

We all welcome that but is the Government financing the purchase of those items with payroll savings? That appears to be where the savings are being made and the money is coming from.

Fine Gael made a poor attempt to have a pop at Fianna Fáil in this debate but it is Fine Gael which has downgraded the Defence portfolio and removed it as a full Cabinet portfolio. We did not do that. Fine Gael did that and it has continued with that policy. The Minister of State said the Fine Gael record is one of standing up for the Defence Forces but there would have been a mass rolling of eyes across the country as people listened to that statement. The Fine Gael record is low morale, haemorrhaging of key and highly skilled personnel and persistent under-resourcing and understaffing of our Defence Forces. That is Fine Gael's record to date.

Did the Minister of State review the Department's submission to the Low Pay Commission? Did the four pages reflect the significance of the remuneration issues that exist in the Defence Forces? Did the submission comment on the retention crisis? The answer is "no", so where in that submission has the Minister of State or Fine Gael stood up for the Defence Forces? What does the Minister of State think members of the Reserve Defence Force are going to feel about Government support for their organisation? They are currently at below 2,000 effective members when the figure should be more than 4,000. I have made numerous suggestions in questions in this Chamber and on Committee Stage on how we might address the issues affecting the Reserve Defence Force. I did this because the Minister of State asked me to do so. I have made very reasonable suggestions for things might work but the Government has yet to implement any one of them. The Minister of State will excuse me if I do not feel his commitment to the Reserve Defence Force is obvious, because it is not.

The Minister of State said the reorganisation of the Defence Forces was designed to maximise operational capacity and provide for an organisation that is flexible and can accommodate new or unprecedented demands. Does he really believe the 2012 reorganisation has achieved this? In my view it has failed miserably. The removal of headquarter structures has removed critical layers of management and officer levels are at 50% in some units. Command and control are key to maintaining an operational Defence Forces. To have command and control, one needs to be close to one's troops but that is not the current situation in the Defence Forces. This is a clear example of where the Department of Defence and the Defence Forces organisation have diverged, with the Department clearly winning out in this case.

I thank every Deputy who contributed sincerely to this debate. I acknowledge the constructive nature of Labour Party and Sinn Féin amendments. Neither proposed to delete anything from the Fianna Fáil motion and only sought to add to it. In that spirit I wish to be as accommodating as possible. This motion is not about me or any party but about the Defence Forces and those who serve in them. It is a shame that Deputies Mick Barry and Bríd Smith who exited the Chamber fairly swiftly did not appreciate that and are more concerned as usual with having a go at Fianna Fáil than with making a genuine contribution to the issue at hand. There is a lot of merit in the Sinn Féin amendment and I am happy to accept parts (a) and (b), as previously discussed, but unfortunately I, on behalf of the Fianna Fáil Party, will not be able to accept part 1(c). If Sinn Féin had inserted a part (d) to the amendment about the domestic terms of employment of the Defence Forces, we would have been happy to accept it.

There is clearly a crisis in the Defence Forces. This has come to the fore in recent years. I appreciate that it was not all the Minister of State's doing. He was handed a very depleted organisation by his predecessor, the Minister, Deputy Simon Coveney, who has happened to walk away scot free on this. The Minister of State will have been made aware by me and other Deputies in the past year of the serious deficiencies in the Defence Forces and the fact we are lacking key skilled personnel. We are haemorrhaging people at an alarming rate, but to date the Minister of State has not put forward any retention policy to show how he is going to address that issue. We will not sit here and hear him talk about the ongoing efforts of the recruitment campaign. While it is commendable and necessary, it does not address the lack of a retention policy in order that we can keep the personnel we need. In the light of Brexit, an ever-changing international defence environment and emerging threats that the Minister or I may not be able to see at the moment but could be there tomorrow, we need to ensure the Defence Forces are adequately resourced, fit for purpose and able to adapt and respond to the challenges our country may face. In the light of this, the motion is broad and comprehensive and deals directly with those deficiencies. We call for the re-establishment of the 4th Western Brigade, increased enlistment up to 10,500 and monitoring of the implementation of the White Paper. All these are very sensible and reasonable suggestions and I commend the motion to the House. Fianna Fáil is willing to accept parts 1(a) and 1(b) of the Sinn Féin amendment but not part 1(c).

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