Jan O'Sullivan (Limerick City, Labour) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the decision of Sinn Féin to use the party's Private Members' time to give Deputies an opportunity to debate this issue. Some of us had an opportunity to debate this matter two weeks ago and it will be on the agenda again tomorrow.

The House must collectively try to figure out the best way to get to the truth of what occurred in mother and baby homes. None of us has a monopoly of wisdom in this regard. All of those who drafted amendments to the motion have tried to work towards the best way to approach this issue. I will move an amendment on behalf of the Labour Party. I agree that we must first ensure the commission does its work and my party's amendment refers to the commission for this reason.

The amendment also provides that the Minister will publish the interim report. I note she has given a commitment to do so, although it has not yet been published. It is also essential that the terms of reference of the commission are expanded because it is not adequate to cover only 14 mother and baby homes and four county homes. Many people living among us have experience of other homes in other locations that are not included in the list. Many were born in institutions that are not on the list. For this reason, our amendment prioritises publishing the interim report and expanding the commission's terms of reference.

In terms of getting to the truth, we need to focus on the work of Catherine Corless. Ms Corless, through unstinting and determined research, found death certificate after death certificate and kept digging until she was able to expose to all of us at least some of the truth of what happened in just one mother and baby home, namely, the Tuam home. Bessborough mother and baby home is another institution that has been cited but there must be similar stories in other parts of the country. We must shine a light on all of them because if we do not do so, we will not have the full truth we all seek.

We must ensure the people who went to mother and baby homes or were born in them are the first priority in terms of consultation. The Minister referred to consultation with academics, historians, recognised experts in transitional justice and others. She also indicated she had consulted survivors and people who had personal experience of the awful hurt imposed by society on the women in question and their children. The most important persons in all of this are the women and children who were affected. Irrespective of whether a truth commission or another forum is established to address this issue, the views of the women and children who experienced the mother and baby homes must be afforded greater importance than those of anyone else.

What happened to the babies must also be central to the commission's work. We know there was malnutrition, children were not properly fed and mortality rates among children in mother and baby homes were much higher than among children of similar ages in Ireland at the time. We also know the children in these homes were used as guinea pigs in vaccine trials and that illegal adoptions took place. However, we do not know the full truth in respect of any of these issues, all of which must be examined.

I do not know if a truth commission is the correct approach. There are different versions of the role of a truth commission. I am particularly concerned that a truth commission could in some way delay the work being done by the commission, which must be the priority. I am also concerned that such a commission could delay justice. As previous speakers noted, many of those who experienced mother and baby homes are getting on in life and some may wish to seek justice in the courts. We must not place obstacles in their way.

Having said that, I do not object to the concept of a truth commission, although, as I stated, I do not know exactly what it would entail. While the term "truth commission" slips off the tongue easily, what precisely does it involve? The commission to inquire into child abuse, for example, sat for a number of years and held private and public hearings at which people told their stories. As my party's spokesperson on the issue at the time, I met many survivors who were involved in that process. Some viewed the commission as positive because it allowed them to deal with their experience, while others believed it did not help them. We need to learn from all of that in deciding what type of forum we will establish.

The Minister cited the words of Seamus Heaney, which called to mind the words written by Leonard Cohen:

There is a crack in everything,

That's how the light gets in.

We must recognise the large cracks in our past and present by letting in the light. Leonard Cohen is a good example of someone who had great compassion for people who had been hurt by life and had to deal with all kinds of difficulties. We must take a similar compassionate approach. While I agree with Deputy Ó Laoghaire that compassion is essential, on its own, it is not what people want. They want to ensure that everything that happened to them is exposed, that they have a say and that there is some way they can get truth and justice in so far as that can be achieved. Achieving justice may be difficult because one cannot give people back their lives or babies. However, we have to reach conclusions that will reflect the best we can do at this stage.

I also agree with Deputies Funchion, Rabbitte and others that we must learn from the past by providing proper protection for children who are in vulnerable circumstances. While this issue is about the past, it is also very much about building a structure for the future that protects children, particularly the most vulnerable children.

See this speech in context