Eamon Ryan (Dublin Bay South, Green Party) | Oireachtas source

I want to give the House some history of my involvement in this project. It goes back to my time in opposition in the Twenty-ninth Dáil from 2002 to 2007. At that time, we were starting to consider how we would develop an all-island electricity system. We had been blowing up power lines for the previous 30 or 40 years, which had left the North completely cut off. It was a dysfunctional system. It was incredibly expensive for us and for them because one had to keep two spinning reserves to manage this balanced system that an electricity system is. I remember the first plans. The members of the committee at the time were brought down to EirGrid in around 2005 and the project was explained, including the thinking behind it and what we needed to do. In 2007, we created a single all-Ireland electricity market. It was a very significant political connection on the island, perhaps because it was not on the radar of the St. Andrews Agreement or the Good Friday Agreement and the political difficulties of getting things done in those contexts. We were able to get agreement because it made sense on both sides. We asked EirGrid at that stage to look at building this interconnector because we had such poor interconnection between the North and the South.

Already at that stage, concerns were raised. There was a series of "Prime Time" programmes on the issue where people in the relevant areas were, understandably, concerned and asked for consideration of the underground options and alternatives. We did that. I remember going at the time as Minister responsible to Denmark to talk to its TSO because they had the very same problem. They had a line of approximately 140 km on the western part of an island and had been tearing their hair out for ten or 15 years because local communities did not want power lines above ground. They could not find a way to do it. They went everywhere. They went to Japan and all over the world to see if it was possible to provide the grid needed in a balanced system by putting it underground. To this day, they have not found a way and had to build it overground. I was very taken by that.

Deputy Mattie McGrath said these people were fat cats. They are typically public servants, civil servants and engineers working for the Danish state or the Irish State. They are not on a profit margin and they are not fat cats. They are trying to provide an energy system for the people. In Denmark, they could not do it across 140 km of flat, sandy soil whereas we were looking to do something in drumlin country. If they could not do it in flat sandy soil, we were going to have incredible difficulty in drumlin country.

We would love to see this underground. It would be lovely not to have to put power lines up. However, I have yet to see that it is technically feasible. It is technically feasible to send power on a high voltage DC line for 140 km and in fact there will be less transmission loss, but one will end up with a completely different electricity system because the rest of the electricity system is run on AC. Factories and homes are run that way going back to the battle between Edison and Tesla 135 years ago. The battle was won by Tesla and we created an AC electricity system. It may be that in 50 years on foot of developments at local level, an alternative DC system will develop. However, that is in the nature of 50 years away whereas we do not have 50 years to wait because we are in danger of dividing our island. We are in danger of creating a hard border for energy, which would be a disaster for both North and South. It is not technically feasible because of what happens when one runs a direct current, or DC system. One can think of it in a simple way. The physics is tiny. The alternating current is like a rope with kinks in it whereas the direct current is what it says on the tin.

One can pull a direct current over distance and not have much transmission loss. Converting it back into AC to run in the system is an incredibly difficult process. I do not know if people have seen the converter station in Woodtown. It is much bigger and taller than this building. To crack or create an AC current is no small matter. If we want to use this line to help to develop industry in Meath, Monaghan and Cavan, we would have to put a DC converter station in the middle. It is really expensive.

The reason we want AC is because the first thing any employer or any factory owner will ask for is two AC lines rather than one because a factory full of medical equipment, semiconductors or whatever cannot afford a power outage. The reason we are good at attracting foreign direct investment is because we are relatively good at providing a relatively secure electricity grid. It is not because of fat cats that we are doing this. Rather, it is to create jobs and a network that works for Cavan, Monaghan, Meath and Tyrone as much as anywhere else. The reason most of the investment and all of the data centres and factories are coming to Dublin is because we have a dense electricity system here.

There are two AC lines in Dublin which investors know work. Deputies from the west have stated that the grid link project is all about fat cats not thinking of the people. If we want jobs we need to put digital fibre optic cable beside electricity networks that are AC synchronised. That is how we encourage economic development. If we continue to provide DC links we will cut out a part of the country and not develop it.

I am outlining my experience and views. I would love to see this undergrounded, but it is not easy to do so. A large trench is involved, through drumlins, which is bloody difficult to put underground. It could be done, but we will not end up with the functioning electricity system we need to create employment in other areas.

Deputy Sherlock said he did not think the issue of Brexit should be raised. I do not know. There is a real risk in terms of the Northern electricity system. The reason we all received letters from people involved in industry is that they know Northern industry is at risk, as is Border county industry. At some point, if we do not build this they will say, "Feck it, forget the Republic. We will build our own system. We will do a an interconnector with the UK. We will have to do it on our own." That would be an historic mistake in terms of the reunification of this island and what we need to do at a time of Brexit.

They will not wander off. It makes sense for us to maintain an electricity system that is connected North and South no matter what happens with Brexit because the physics make sense. It also makes sense in terms of supporting other industries and development. We cannot develop the project if we wait another ten years. We have been planning this for ten years and if we wait for another ten years the border will be in place and will be set for generations.

I very much understand the motives and communities involved. If there was a miracle tomorrow and the whole system could go DC or we could have a DC system without a massive converter station to convert it to AC in order to provide power connectors connections in the region, we would develop that. To be honest, I do not believe it is technically possible to do so and will not be possible within the next ten or 20 years. People mentioned the Aachen line, but that is a DC line. We know we can develop DC lines, but can we get a synchronised energy system that lifts the Border counties and Northern Ireland? I do not see that, and for that reason I cannot agree with or support the motion.

Ultimately, we would be shooting ourselves in the foot in the Border areas more than anywhere else. We need to get development out of Dublin. In order to do so, we need an electricity grid and fibreoptic cables. If we give up on the grid, we are giving up on economic development.

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