Jim O'Callaghan (Dublin Bay South, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

On Second and Committee Stages, Fianna Fáil's attitude to Part 4 of the Bill, which deals with the purchase of sexual services, has not altered. Therefore, we will not support amendment No. 10. It is important to recall what lies at the heart of prostitution. At its heart lies abuse of vulnerable women and that vulnerability has been growing in recent times. When you look at the statistics in respect of the women involved in prostitution in Ireland, you find that very many of them are immigrant women living in significant states of destitution who are forced into prostitution. I fully recognise that if we criminalise the purchase of prostitution, it will not end it. It will still continue. Notwithstanding that, if we were to adopt that argument, we would criminalise nothing and say things are just going to continue and what is the point in introducing any laws to deal with it. It is extremely important that men recognise and take responsibility for the fact that they get involved in an abusive situation with women. Up to now, they have been able to walk away scot free and the woman is the person who has faced the consequences. For that reason, we will not support amendment No. 10. I do not know what the consequences of this will be in terms of prostitution, however, I believe it will be of assistance to women who find themselves in prostitution because it will lessen demand and that will have a consequence for women who find themselves involved in sex work.

With due respect to Deputy Jan O'Sullivan, I do not think amendment No. 11 is helpful. This amendment could create even greater difficulties for vulnerable women who find themselves working in prostitution. The proposal put forward by the Deputy would mean that moneys that are the proceeds of crime and that are held by sex workers and prostitutes would not be confiscated. This just provides an opportunity for those in organised crime and men who are criminals to force sex workers and prostitutes to hold on to money in the knowledge that this money will be protected from seizure by the Criminal Assets Bureau. Last year, this House introduced legislation to ensure we could have a mini Criminal Assets Bureau whereby smaller amounts of money could be seized. The obvious way for criminals to get around that would be to hand it to women and say, make sure you say this is money you got from sex work or prostitution.

Amendments Nos. 12 and 13 are similar, although the use of the word "unlimited" in amendment No. 13 is not appropriate. It is appropriate that there should be a fine and a punishment for conviction on indictment for the organisation of prostitution. That fine needs to be there and it is important that men or women who are in the business of organising prostitution, which preys on extremely vulnerable women, know that if they are convicted for that, they will face a serious sentence and that on indictment, they could face a sentence of up to ten years.

Amendment No. 14 from Deputy Jonathan O'Brien and amendment No. 15 would defeat the whole purpose of the legislation. What we are trying to do is to ensure there is criminalisation of the purchase of sex. Amendment No. 14 states no person shall be prosecuted for an offence under this section where the premises is used by that person to provide his or her own sexual services and that section 10(1) does not apply to that person. My reading of that is that there would be no prosecutions if the sex work was provided in the sex worker's own accommodation. That defeats the whole purpose of the legislation because it would be so easy to get around it. Everyone would simply engage in the services in their own accommodation.

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