Willie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I thank all the Deputies who contributed today. It was remiss of me not to welcome Mr. Brendan Courtney to the Visitors Gallery and to compliment him on his outstanding documentary. Rarely have I seen a television programme that engendered such a public reaction, particularly in the Limerick area that I am familiar with. I am sure that has been replicated all over the country. He has certainly done us all an enormous service. I want to thank Deputies Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin, Michael Collins, Mattie McGrath, Alan Kelly, Noel Rock and all the other speakers who supported the principle of this Bill.

The elderly people of this country are not bed blockers or demographic time bombs. They are the people who worked, paid their way, made sacrifices and built up this country. It is incumbent on us as a Parliament and on any Government that is democratically elected by the Irish people to look after them and do all that is necessary to ensure that they can live out their declining years with dignity.

In her initial response, the Minister of State made three arguments against the Bill as currently drafted. She said that the Bill confers an entitlement to home care services and that there is no such entitlement under the fair deal scheme. I appreciate that the Minister of State used her own words, but I have been in her position in the past. Sometimes a Minister gets a script from the Department. I felt when I was in government as well as now that people put across arguments just as fillers to say that they have arguments 1, 2, 3 and 4. The fact of the matter is that there is a statutory entitlement to the fair deal scheme. It is demand-led. If one satisfies the criteria, one has an entitlement. One might not be able to get it because the money is not there, but ultimately one will get it if one lives long enough. The same applies if one substitutes home care for the fair deal scheme. Therefore, that is really a non-argument.

The Minister of State mentioned that an unintended consequence of the Bill was that the fair deal scheme could be overwhelmed. I cannot see why. There is a team of experts who assess a person's eligibility for residential care. They are people who know the situation of the patient; they will have just assessed him or her under the nursing home scheme. They will also have access to the home care services. They will know what home care services are available in the area. They have people to advise them on the cost. I cannot see for one moment how the extra consideration that would need to be given to offer a home care package would overwhelm the fair deal scheme. God help us if it could. I do not accept that.

The Minister of State made a point on cost. Under the residential care scheme and the nursing home scheme, people have to pay if they have assets. Their assets are assessed, etc. When a statutory home care scheme is introduced in this country, whether or not there will be a payment element in it is a matter for the Government that drafts the legislation. I will make the point that when I say that the residential scheme costs almost four times as much as a home care package, I am talking in net terms, exclusive of what the contribution is from the people who are availing of the fair deal scheme. The net cost to the State is still on average about three to four times what a home care package would cost. I take Deputy Ó Caoláin's point on this as I think he makes a good point. If we introduced a system of charging for home care, we would find almost invariably that when people are being cared for in their own homes among their own families and if there is a decent package in place, the families will be making their own contribution also. They will be contributing. It will lessen their capacity to contribute if they have to contribute in addition to the HSE.

6 o’clock

The Government amendment proposes the Bill be read a Second Time on this day six months. I am informed by people who are better at calendars than myself that this day six months is the 26 July. I thought the Ceann Comhairle would have to work that out but I have it worked out for him. I was wondering about it because I do not anticipate that the Dáil will be sitting on 26 July, so can I take it that if the Dáil has gone into recess before the 26 July Members will return here? I would be ready to come back.

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