John Curran (Dublin Mid West, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

Effectively, the early years of their employment is what is causing the problem and that goes back to the annual averaging.

One of the reasons this matter has come to light in recent years is the fact that there are more bands of payments and people are dropping into lower bands than might have been the case previously. To get the top rate, I believe that an annual average of 48 or more contributions is required. The Minister has introduced additional bands so people are moving a little down the pecking order.

This debate should not be confined to homemakers. It is largely to do with the issue of annual averaging from the point of view of equality in the system. The homemaker's credit is an issue but I have come across people who took time out of their working careers because they went back to college or whatever. That is a different scenario but they do not have a high enough annual average, although they might have a good number of total contributions. Many people of my age that I know who were working at 16 or 17 will have 50 years to average their total payments. It is the annual averaging that is at the crux of this.

Predominantly, the people presenting are homemakers but I have come across other individuals who took time out of work for one reason or another. They may have started work at a young age, subsequently went on to college or whatever and, therefore, they do not have that continuous working career. This is somewhat unfair on those people when we consider that somebody who might have come to this country as a 40 year old and worked for 20 or 25 years will have full entitlement to a contributory pension. The scheme must be examined in considerable detail.

Deputies Brady and O'Dea will be aware that the Joint Committee on Social Protection will examine the issue of pensions but, to be honest, we cannot do that on our own because of the wealth of information that resides in the Department. That is the key. Many people qualify for pensions in different ways and we must be very careful to ensure that changes we make do not have unintended consequences for people currently in receipt of pensions. Our committee needs to develop our report working closely with the Department because the statistical information we require to test any of the proposed changes resides only in the Department. I fully support Deputy Bríd Smith regarding the issue she has raised but I would like to see it developed to include people other than just the homemakers.

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