Brendan Howlin (Wexford, Labour) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Deputies who contributed to the debate. Newer Deputies might not be aware that sometimes we have not had the opportunity to have the type of open debate on the abortion issue as is possible in this Dáil. Much reference has been made to the information legislation that was brought to the House by the then Minister, Deputy Michael Noonan. I drafted that legislation in 1994 when I was Minister for Health. At the time, my office in Wexford was picketed for three weeks by Youth Defence. On one Saturday its members put posters on every storefront on Main Street stating that "Howlin murders babies". That was the atmosphere of the 1990s.

It was the atmosphere of the debate we had when the original eighth amendment was proposed in the 1980s. We have come a very long way. There are only two Oireachtas Members still here who voted against the original amendment in 1983, namely, me and, as far as I remember, the Minister, Deputy Shane Ross, who was a Member of the Seanad, as I was, at the time. The atmosphere was poisonous. There was no objective debate on it. Although we have moved a long way from it, there is still potential for a poisonous debate on it, and we need to anchor ourselves in calmness as best we can. We must allow people who have genuine concerns, whatever their perspective, to be heard but at the same time anchor ourselves in objective fact. Objective fact is becoming a scarce commodity in political discourse generally, as we have seen in the conduct of the US presidential election.

The purpose of the Bill is straightforward, simple and unambiguous. It is to ensure whoever holds themselves out as counsellors in a crisis pregnancy would be required to be regulated in such a way that all the advice and information they impart must be truthful and accurate. I listened to Deputy Mattie McGrath passionately argue for the same principle and then conclude that he was going to oppose the Bill. There is no logic in that. If he believes, whatever perspective one brings, that one must tell the truth, he must support the Bill, given that this is what the Bill sets out to do.

There are two mechanisms under consideration, and we examined both of them. The first is the proposal we have before the House, using the Health and Social Care Professionals Act by adding to the list another category of health professional that would be required to be regulated, namely, pregnancy counsellors. I listened with care to the Minister's views. In all such matters there is always complexity. He proffered the view that the better alternative would be the Regulation of Information (Services Outside the State For Termination of Pregnancies) Act 1995 which Deputy Ruth Coppinger referenced. We examined the Act in some detail and the difficulty is that it applies only to "Act information", which is information relating to the procurement of an abortion. If a practitioner said he or she was not going to give any counselling relating to abortion, the information would not be "Act information" and could be as inaccurate, mischievous and damaging as one likes. The advice I received was that it was not the best vehicle to use. I imagine this is why there have not been prosecutions under the Act. It is related to dealing with the Supreme Court decision that giving information, even names and addresses, about places to have an abortion outside this jurisdiction was not tolerated under the eighth amendment. That was why we introduced the subsequent amendment on information and travel. I will happily work with the Minister for Health and his officials, by whatever means is open us, to arrive at our objective, which is to ensure women in this most vulnerable situation of crisis pregnancies or pregnancies they did not plan or want will have objective options put to them plainly, truthfully and accurately about what they need to do.

While I do not want to labour the point, I totally disagree with Deputy Mattie McGrath's totally unfair comments on the Irish Family Planning Association, IFPA, which over decades has provided an important service to women, men and families. I salute the IFPA and thank it for its work. Deputy Bríd Smith, in supporting the legislation, asked why we did not bring it forward earlier and said we should have done it previously. This is the first time anybody has done this. There was no consensus in Sinn Féin to repeal the eighth amendment until this Dáil. A significant portion of Sinn Féin would not have been in that category. Sinn Féin did nothing on the issue in the previous Dáil, and it had plenty of Private Members' time in which it could have done it. We should all come to this with a view that the thousands of women who find themselves pregnant when they do not want to be and who are worried and stressed need to be able to turn with confidence to those who hold themselves out to be counsellors and also need to know that whatever is told to them is the truth. They do not want to be horrified with lies and untruths.

It is a reasonable expectation that as we regulate chiropodists, podiatrists and dietitians, this category of medical advice should also be regulated. It is such an important decision that has lasting impacts on people's lives, and we must have regard to this. As my colleague, Deputy Joan Burton, said, it is not an extraordinarily complicated Bill. It is very straightforward and simply adds a new category to the list of professionals to be regulated. There is already a long list to be regulated, some of which are set out in the Act and others which have been added on under the Act by a decision of the Minister for Health. We have said it should be put directly into the Act, given that it is the quickest and most effective way of doing it. If there are difficulties with it or a more effective route to achieving the objective on which we have, by and large, a consensus or a majority view, I would be open to whatever route is best to achieve it. I look forward to working with all colleagues across all benches in the House to achieve the desired objective of the overwhelming majority of Dáil Members.

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