David Stanton (Cork East, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I congratulate the Ceann Comhairle on his appointment and wish him well. He has made a good start.

I spent 15 years on the Opposition benches, and in that time one reform occurred, namely, the introduction of Leaders' Questions, which were kind of happening anyway, but they were formalised in Standing Orders. There was nothing else, zero, zilch. Once reform occurs, it gets built in and people think that is the way it always was. In the last Dáil there were a number of reforms, such as the bringing of Topical Issues forward to the middle of the day, extra Leaders' Questions and legislative scrutiny. The latter was a major reform and happened down in the dungeons of the committees, and a lot of people did not know it was happening. Over the past five years, 7,386 witnesses came in and spoke to, engaged with and gave their views to Members of the Oireachtas. That is a very significant reform. This pre-legislative scrutiny meant that the legislation was scrutinised prior to being published. What happened prior to that was legislation was published, brought in here after being through the drafting office and finished and set, and Deputies could do nothing of any substance with it whatsoever. At the pre-legislative committees, though, members were able to take the heads of the Bill and make major changes on the advice of NGOs, expert groups and ordinary citizens, who came in to suggest those changes to the Government Department and the Minister. In the main, quite a number of those suggestions were taken on board.

Deputy Zappone and I worked very closely in the justice committee and brought a large number of Bills and reports through that committee, and they are there on the record. That was a major change but, because it happened away from this Chamber, where the grandstanding and politics occurred, it was very often unseen and unheard. However, it did make a difference because one of the main jobs we have here is to produce, scrutinise, analyse, discuss and debate legislation. That is very hard to do it in a Chamber like this where somebody comes in and reads out a 20-minute speech, possibly a script that someone else has prepared for them. I have noticed over the years - I am here almost 20 - that sometimes people come in and read a script and one knows it is the first time they have seen it.

I suggest, as one reform, that we get rid of scripts. It is in Standing Orders anyway that no scripts should be used, apart from those of Ministers, who must be accurate in a legal sense. Apart from that, we should internalise the material, make it our own and be able to speak to the topic. We can have bullet points but reading out a script that a researcher has prepared is not really making the legislation our own.

We should be more involved with the budgetary process. We tried this with the justice committee, as well with the idea of following the money. The OECD produced a report last year and the Oireachtas working group of Chairs asked for it. A former Deputy, Mr. Liam Twomey, was very much involved with that. A fantastic report was produced, with one table illustrating specific issues in parliamentary engagement. There is an index of legislative budgetary institutions in the OECD and Ireland is the poorest of all. We do not scrutinise the budget at all to any extent. This takes time, work and effort. We must roll up the sleeves, swot and study. We must spend time in the committee rooms. How many Deputies are prepared to do that and spend the time that I and Deputy Zappone did with the justice committee, out of sight and out of mind? People are worried about being home in the constituency.

Fianna Fáil has produced some very interesting suggestions in its proposal for Dáil reform, although I have one point of difference with the Deputy who spoke earlier, which is the idea that nothing is agreed until everything is agreed. That was the case up to approximately ten years ago. The Government Chief Whip at the time, former Deputy Pat Carey, and I tried that idea and although a package was always produced, when somebody objected to one issue in it, nothing happened. We must be careful about that. If that proviso is included, there is a risk that one Deputy on the committee might not agree with an issue and then nothing would happen.

I wish this initiative well and it is exciting. The committee should carry on anyway as a standing committee right through this Dáil.

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