Jan O'Sullivan (Limerick City, Labour) | Oireachtas source

The problem with this in the wording the Deputies propose is that the terms must be agreed with the staff trade union and that is, in effect, a veto.

Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan referred to the junior cycle reform. We are in a position where one of the trade unions has voted in favour, another has not, and the representatives of parents and of management bodies etc. want us to go ahead with junior cycle reform. We are going ahead with junior cycle reform. In my opinion, one cannot let one of the partners hold something back.

I agree with the Deputies that we need full consultation and that is why we have repeatedly stated to the institutes that they must engage meaningfully with those who work in them, the academic and other staff. However, saying that it must be agreed with the trade union before it can go ahead is giving the trade union a veto and is not something that would be done. There must be normal negotiations. The union represents its members, but it is giving a veto to state a merger cannot go ahead unless the union has agreed.

What we want is meaningful consultation. As I said, staff have been released in order to engage in that consultation. We will continue to impress upon the institutes that they must properly consult and take on board the concerns of their members. Indeed, as I said, as recently as Monday evening last I met the TUI's representatives in Cork. We want to listen to its views, and I have taken some of them on board in terms of the amendments. Probably, more properly, I have taken on board the issues that the Deputies have raised on their behalf. However, stating that the merger cannot go ahead without their agreement is taking the normal relationships with a trade union to an extent that would not be proper to put in the primary legislation.

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