Anthony Lawlor (Kildare North, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

As I stated earlier, I welcome the opportunity to speak to this Bill as I grew up beside a fence, most probably in Punchestown. I have been involved with the legislation from when the heads were first put before a committee or even before that.

It seems that some of the Bill is seeking to legislate on what I would call common sense in that people are using common sense already but we seem to be legislating for it. It is not evident in many practices but in the horse racing industry, much common sense prevails, both in the Turf Club and Horse Racing Ireland, HRI. Some of the pernickety elements of the Bill try to rule out the use of common sense. If we were to look at this again, we might eliminate the pieces that might rule out using common sense.

Part of the Bill arises from the Indecon report and there is a move to eliminate duplication. One of the key areas mentioned is HRI and the Turf Club having individual financial structures, but I find it difficult to see how we can eliminate that when representatives of the Turf Club are asked to appear before an Oireachtas committee to account for its finances. It would need a full accounting section within the Turf Club for that to be possible, so why are we examining means of eliminating this duplication? I do not see that happening. It is one of the questions I asked the members of HRI when they came before the committee. Specifically, I asked how many staff would be lost arising from this partial amalgamation but I was told nobody would lose his or her job. When I asked about savings, I was told they would not amount to an awful lot. One must ask why many parts of this Bill are in place. Has there been a value for money review of HRI? Indecon produced an overall report but has a value for money analysis of HRI been done?

The real concern is the independence of the Turf Club because whatever opportunity it had for generating income, although it is not being removed, is being directed somewhere else through HRI and then back to the Turf Club. I am concerned about this because of what happened in the UK with the amalgamation of the regulatory body and the people who run the sector to form the British Horseracing Authority. The Minister is aware of an issue from a few years ago arising from the close links between the regulatory body that would follow up on a matter and a major owner. There were serious concerns about that and I am worried that something similar could happen here, although I hope that will not be the case. The Turf Club is being pulled in more. The Jockey Club ran the regulatory side of the Turf Club in the UK but it is now gone completely. I am concerned about that. The Turf Club is like any other club around the country, including the rugby or GAA club in the Minister's constituency. It is filled with volunteers who steward at racetracks and point-to-point meetings throughout the country. I hope what happened in the UK is not repeated here.

The Turf Club must be independent and part of that is about its ability to access its own finance as quickly as possible instead of having to go cap in hand to HRI all the time. If it does not have that ability, its integrity may be compromised. I am fearful about that as we have tremendous integrity in the racing industry.

On the appeals issue, when a judgment is made by the Turf Club, the person has a right to appeal the judgment, but in certain circumstances the legislation indicates that during the appeals process, whatever punishment was issued to the appellant is suspended. In certain circumstances, a position could arise where the offence is abhorrent but the appellant would be allowed to practice under the rules of racing. That should not be allowed. A fellow tried and convicted for murder is not released when the appeal is ongoing. He would be in jail. This goes back to the issue of common sense. In such cases, the waiving of a sentence while an appeal is taking place should not be allowed.

I apologise for going on but I have a good few more points to cover if I can. I am really passionate about the area. The foal levy-----

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