Robert Dowds (Dublin Mid West, Labour) | Oireachtas source

It is a tragedy this motion is before us. Like other speakers, I begin by expressing my sympathy with the Lynch, Gilbert and Connors families over the appalling tragedy in Carrickmines last month.

There is no question there is absolute truth in the figures mentioned by Deputy Pringle in terms of life expectancy, to just take that one very blatant and obvious example of how the Traveller community suffers from discrimination. That can also be seen on the housing front, which is from where this motion arises, and in the unemployment situation. I am aware from my work with the Traveller community in my own constituency, and from my wife's work with Travellers over several years, how difficult it is for Traveller people to, for example, break into the workforce. I remember my wife telling me about a young Traveller woman she had taught who had a job in a drapery store but in order to get that job, she had to disguise the fact she was a Traveller. In a sense, that points very clearly to the question of discrimination.

With regard to the whole question of ethnicity, if the Traveller community has a common view on that issue, I am quite happy that it be granted ethnicity. Given what Deputy Halligan said about DNA examination, it seems the Traveller community split from the more settled Irish community more than 1,000 years ago. Ironically, that makes Travellers probably the most Irish group within this country because most of us, if we look back on our past, will find many aspects of it lead us to other countries as well as to Ireland.

When I was a county councillor on South Dublin County Council between 1999 and 2011, on several occasions we had proposals to build Traveller accommodation. Before I was on the council, there had been quite a number of situations where there was a stand-off between the settled community and Travellers over accommodation. However, in conjunction with other parties - Deputy Crowe will remember this because he was on the council at the time - we made strides because we decided not to make this a political issue. As a result, quite a number of Traveller accommodation was delivered. It is a pity that was not taken on board by, for example, Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown County Council, which seems to have done as little as possible. Then, under the guidance of a previous county manager in South Dublin County Council, efforts were made, with some degree of success, to employ Travellers in various sections of the county council. In that sense, in a small way, and I do not want to overstate it, we pointed a way towards the future. It is very important that more effort is made between the Traveller community and the settled community to bring about a situation whereby it is possible for more Travellers to get involved in the workforce.

It would be very easy for me just to sit down at this stage. However, if we are being frank and honest, there is a long story of tension between the Irish settled community and the Traveller community, and it has probably got worse in recent years. Part of that arises from the fact some of the areas of work Travellers would originally have been involved in, such as selling items door to door, and production and mending of kitchen utensils, have gone. It is also the case that, in an urban setting, the whole business of keeping horses, which I know is dear to the heart of some Travellers, has become a difficulty. There needs to be a serious discussion between the settled community and the Traveller community as to how we can best live side by side in that regard. I would like it if we could get to a situation, on a formal basis, where there was regular discussion between the Traveller community and the settled community as to how we can both move forward together.

Some of the fears the settled community have in regard to Travellers are unfounded but, unfortunately, there are examples which do not help. In that regard, it is very good that, for example, a number of Traveller women I know, and Pavee Point, make it clear that, like the settled community, the Traveller community must be subject to the rule of law. However, things sometimes happen that cause real problems. For example, in South Dublin County Council, there was at one stage a loan scheme for buying caravans and, unfortunately, that had to be abandoned because so few of the loans were repaid.

We must try to get something positive out of this appalling negative happening in Carrickmines. I suggest that we set up, on a permanent basis, a forum where there is continuous dialogue between the Traveller community and the settled community as to how we can best move forward together so that, on both sides, people can lead fulfilling lives. That is a real challenge for us and it is a challenge we must rise to in order to get away from the situation where life expectancy among Travellers is so much less than it is among the settled community.

We need to get to a situation where living conditions are satisfactory for both the settled and Traveller communities and to a position where Travellers who want to can move into a more settled, permanent situation. If we are to gain something positive from this appalling tragedy, we need to have a regular forum that will point the way to the future.

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