Finian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Chair for giving me the opportunity to speak about the report on penal reform. I commend all those involved in its production and congratulate Senator Ivana Bacik, my colleagues and the Chairman, Deputy David Stanton, on the work done in the production of such reports by the committee. I also thank all colleagues for their participation in the debate because the committee is always looking for ideas and solutions. Under the guidance of the Chairman, it takes a cross-party approach to every issue. This is particularly important in dealing with issues such as the report on penal reform.

The core issues when dealing with penal reform are the causes of crime; the social and economic issues; the issue of educational disadvantage; prison and after care services. I agree strongly with the point made by Deputy David Stanton that the report should have been brought before the Dáil within six months. I am aware that the Minister of State has said he will bring this to the notice of the Minister, Deputy Frances Fitzgerald. We cannot lag behind on issues such as this.

On the causes of crime, we must face the fact that a high percentage of the prison population come from severely economically and socially disadvantaged backgrounds. I do not accept, however, that all children from poor communities become involved in crime. I know the truth of this having worked in a disadvantaged school for over 25 years. Approximately 80% of the children who were disadvantaged economically never got into trouble and I take my hat off to their parents who got their kids to school every morning. Many of them did not have enough money in their pockets, yet their children attended school and did their best. However, approximately 15% or 20% of the children who attended the school faced issues, including poverty and disadvantage. They also faced personal and dysfunctional family issues. As one would know from talking to prisoners at a later stage, these issues of violence, hurt and anger played a major part in their problems. We must consider these issues in depth as causes of crime and a reason for the greater numbers of prisoners in the system.

We need a strong emphasis on crime prevention. We need to intervene early to deal with the problem. We have a prison population of 3,768, but we all want to see a reduction in these numbers. I am open to radical change in prison sentences and believe the proposal on community courts is excellent. We have seen this work elsewhere and visitors from the United States have spoken to us about them. Some of my colleagues have also witnessed the workings of these courts at first hand. I am impressed by the system as a solution and encourage the Minister to consider launching a pilot project. Such courts would deal with many of the issues that arise.

The issue on which I disagree with some colleagues is the sentences handed down to violent individuals and violent prisoners. I do not accept that they should not be locked up. Violent people must be locked up. If a journalist walking home from the pub at night is beaten up and murdered, there must be a custodial sentence. In a situation where a young plumber such as Anthony Campbell is blown away by those involved in gangland crime because he happens to be in a place at the wrong time, the people resposible must be locked up. We must face up to this reality. When I speak about reducing prison sentences, I am speaking about sentences for non-violent crimes. We must consider this issue. I agree with many of the recommendations and commonsense proposals made in regard to after care services for prisoners. We must deal with this issue if we want prisoners to be reintegrated into their communities.

Early intervention structures are important. Take, for example, a wonderful service offered in my constituency by the Don Bosco care service. It looks after over 100 young boys from dysfunctional families and families in crisis. It offers after care projects, training and education projects and operates in various locations throughout the city of Dublin. It does an excellent job, yet it is fighting for its budget and has taken a hit of approximately €200,000. If we are serious about having early intervention measures, we need to support the services which deal with these issues.

Drugs are another source of concern as they bring crime and threats to communities. Certain parts of the city and certain roads and streets are dominated by gangland leaders who cause mayhem and intimidation. We need to come up with radical and sensible solutions to this problem. The committee intends to look at this issue and consider all of the different aspects such as legalisation and decriminalisation of drugs. We must have an open mind on the issue. Some young people are sucked into incidents once or twice and we do not want to label them forever.

I strongly support the suggestion that we need a Minister to work full time on the drugs issue.

Like Deputy David Stanton, I took part in the visit to see the conditions in Cork Prison. It is a very interesting place. It is welcome that work on the new prison is under way. At the time I was concerned that there would be a row over planning permission, but, apparently, that issue has been resolved. The new prison is urgently needed.

While I support the proposals made in the report, we must decide what to do about the victims of crime who seem to have been left out of the debate. That is a complaint I regularly hear from constituents. We do not do enough for them. The new Garda Commissioner has said she will up her game and try to do something about the issue. Many victims of crime feel neglected and say there is too much emphasis on the criminal. That is a valid criticism. I am not losing my sense of social justice on prisoners’ rights and equality, but victims of crime are part of the equation. I know a young man who was shot outside a pub in my constituency. He was very badly wounded and is lucky to be alive. He was out of work for two years. Both he and his family suffered. He is still getting over it, but he has received nothing for himself or his family, even though he has lost two years wages. That is unacceptable. We need to consider after care services for victims, too.

I welcome the reduction in non-violent prisoner numbers. If somebody takes out a knife or blows somebody away, that is a red line issue in society. I agree with commuting prison sentences of less than six months, increasing the standard remission rate and introducing the incentivised remission scheme, of up to one half. I support this because I believe in rewarding good behaviour. If somebody makes a mistake and makes an effort to turn around, we should definitely reward and encourage this. We should also introduce legislation to provide for structured release, temporary release, parole and a community return. We have also considered addressing prison conditions. It is welcome that this is happening. It is also welcome that the review group recommended establishing a group that would report every six months to the Minister for Justice and Equality. It is headed by Dr. Mary Rogan, head of law at Dublin Institute of Technology.

When the committee publishes its report on gangland crime, we will want it to be debated within a matter of months. Deputy David Stanton suggested timeframe of six months, but three or four would be better. We also want to see recommendations being implemented. I know that Ministers are busy, but if there are five or six sensible suggestions from a committee representing all members of the different parties and groups in the Dáil, we should move on them. I welcome the debate and warmly welcome the report.

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