Barry Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I have raised this issue with the Minister on a number of occasions since his motion containing measures to address the Government's mishandling of this process since its initiation 18 months ago. There is no doubt that the local authorities throughout the country were under the belief that they would benefit from and accrue the revenue from commercial rates applicable to Irish Water. This has been scuppered by virtue of what was contained in the motion, in this Bill and also in this amendment.

I am assured that the figure of €59 million is concrete and I am assured that the process of evaluation has been carried out to such an extent that this figure becomes more concrete. I ask the Minister to confirm to me today, yet again, that the figure of €59 million is absolute and is as a result of the scientific analysis of the networks - a result of that analysis having produced valuations throughout the country which he stated yesterday have amounted to €11 billion. Can he quantify - if not today but by placing the information in the Oireachtas Library - the total valuations for the country? I refer to a parliamentary question I submitted on 25 or 26 November in which I asked the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform if he could provide details of the commercial rates liability of the semi-State companies and make a statement on the matter with particular emphasis on the likes of Irish Water. I was assured that the levying of rates is a matter for local authorities and the amount of rates to be collected from a rated occupier, whether a semi-State company or otherwise, is the function of the annual rate or valuation, ARV, set by each local authority and the value of the property on the valuation list. That is my reason for seeking the placement, on the public record and in the Oireachtas Library, of the valuations pertaining to all those assets throughout the country amounting to €11 billion, as stated by the Minister yesterday.

I am conscious of the Minister's comment, when commending the amendment to the House, that the scope of the investigation had not yet been finalised. I am none the wiser in this regard and perhaps the Minister might advise me of the position. As minimal as that statement from him was, does it indicate that the figure of €59 million is not set in stone?

During the debate on Committee Stage Deputies have sought a great deal of clarification of the figures the Government has produced. Last week, for example, when the House discussed the €130 million estimated cost of the conservation grant, we had the debacle of the Minister stating the figure could increase by €36 million. The explanation given was that the scheme would be demand-led. I assume the Minister expects 100% compliance with it, given the fanfare with which the introduction of the conservation grant was announced. Not alone has the House not been provided with exact information on the costs associated with the conservation grant, but Deputies specifically have also sought details of the costs the Department of Social Protection will incur in administering and allocating the grant. I hope this information will be provided in this or the Upper House before the debate on the Bill concludes. How many staff will the Department of Social Protection require over and above its existing complement to administer the grant? What will be the cost of these staff and what other administrative costs will arise?

Last night we were given information on the €460 million to be provided for the Housing Finance Agency on foot of obligations and liabilities on the part of local authorities. We were not aware that this amount was to be paid to the agency until the relevant amendment was introduced. As I stated last night, this measure contravenes and contradicts the Water Services (No. 2) Act passed by the House at this time last year. If Deputies had been able to adequately scrutinise, investigate and question that legislation, we might have secured a change of heart by the Government in the past year. The Government did not return to the House to seek its authority or permission to repay this loan. Perhaps it believes it does not need our permission, given that it has a substantial majority in the House. It is disregarding the democratic process and the authority of the House which assumes ownership of the process of disbursing taxpayers' funds.

I expect the Minister to give a commitment to place in the Oireachtas Library information on how the Department arrived at the figure I outlined. If he is unable to give such a commitment, given his statement that the liability is ongoing, will he indicate whether it is likely that the figure will increase? If so, what will be the timescale? I find it unfortunate in the extreme that he is rushing this legislation without providing the relevant figures for the House.

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