Niall Collins (Limerick, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the opportunity to participate in this timely debate. The Minister has outlined the significant issues which have arisen in the administration of justice. This Bill deals with a central proposed reform of the Garda Síochána and is to be welcomed.

I agree with the principle of an independent system for appointments but Deputy Ross's Bill misses the point which has been debated in this House over recent months. The Members of this House all agree on the need for the establishment of an independent policing authority. The provisions in Deputy Ross's Bill would deny an independent policing authority the main function to support and sustain its independence which is the appointment of the most senior person in An Garda Síochána and his or her senior management team. The Bill does not make any sense. I was pleased to hear the Minister say that she will oppose it because my party will also oppose it.

There are currently a number of vacancies in the highest ranks of An Garda Síochána: the Garda Commissioner, Deputy Garda Commissioner, an assistant Garda commissioner vacancy and three chief superintendent vacancies. There is spare capacity at the top of An Garda Síochána and the right people must be found to fill those vacancies. The Minister addressed the issue of the appointment of a Garda Commissioner. This is the subject of my priority parliamentary question to the Minister next week and the Minister in her contribution tonight has addressed my question in part. I suggest the Minister should consider delaying the appointment until an independent policing board is established. The Minister has an ambitious timeline for the establishment by the end of the year of a fully independent and functioning policing board and it is good to aim for targets. However, what we learned on our trip last week is that Scotland established an interim independent policing board and this policy has some merit which the Minister may wish to consider. It may not be helpful to the person who is appointed as Garda Commissioner for a four or five year period if he or she is appointed in advance of the new independent policing authority. Either position might be weakened in that situation.

I agree with previous contributors that An Garda Síochána has experienced a battering, so to speak. We all interact with gardaí every day of the week and they are looking to us for hope. We must give them that hope and we must support them. I have always tried to temper my remarks. I agree we have to hold them to account and I agree we must criticise them - God knows they do not like taking criticism, just as none of us likes taking criticism. An Garda Síochána in particular does not like taking criticism. There needs to be a cultural change in An Garda Síochána and it is beginning to acknowledge the need for such a change. However, I do not agree with some of the points of view of other speakers who have thrown a wet blanket over the entire force, such as that there is a cancer of cronyism and that lots of things are rotten in the force. This is not helpful. I agree there have been problems with issues relating to whistleblowers and with meeting standards and malpractice. Debating those issues all over again will not move the situation forward. We have learned from them but some of the language in this debate is ill-tempered and is not justified. The message some people are trying to send in this debate is that those who have been promoted in An Garda Síochána did not merit their promotions. I did not hear any of those speakers offering any examples. They have no working knowledge of the system of promotion in An Garda Síochána nor of the competition process which brings candidates to the stage whereby they are politically appointed.

This brings me to my next point. Deputy Ross's Bill proposes that the Oireachtas appoint the Garda Commissioner, which is farcical. The Deputy should give us a break, especially as it coincides with the proposal to establish an independent policing board and remove politics from the appointment of senior Garda officers. We know where the sensationalism and populism starts on this issue but where does it end? On the one hand, it is suggested it is wrong for the Executive to appoint a Garda Commissioner, notwithstanding that the Government is accountable and may be, and often is, turfed out of office by the electorate. On the other hand, it is suggested that it would be right for 166 Deputies, or 158 Deputies in the next Dáil, to appoint the next Garda Commissioner. That position does not make sense.

We must adopt a model in which civic society, interest groups and people with appropriate qualifications sit on an independent policing board and drive forward the organisation. These individuals should recruit the chief executive officer of the board and the Garda Commissioner. This model would be in line with practice in the North and in Scotland and the majority of other countries where independent policing authorities appoint the chief of police. This is the model we should adopt. It does not make sense that Deputy Ross, who campaigns against quangos, is seeking to establish a new quango.

The Bill proposes the establishment of a system similar to the Top Level Appointments Commission, TLAC, which appoints senior civil servants. Deputy Ross has been vocal in describing the TLAC process as one in which insiders promote insiders. The hypocrisy evident on this issue shows no bounds. We must learn from the experience in Northern Ireland and Scotland. Last week, I and other members of the Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality visited both jurisdictions where we met representatives of the independent policing boards of Northern Ireland and Scotland. Before last week, I had not taken part in a single junket since entering local politics in 2004. However, I was so interested in trying to ensure this matter is dealt with correctly that I decided to take part in the visit to Belfast and Edinburgh and of course I lived it up during the two-day trip. We packed six meetings into one and a half days, during which we learned with great interest how the Northern Ireland and Scottish independent policing boards operate. Highly structured and transparent systems are in place in both jurisdictions for the appointment of senior police officers. As with Oireachtas committees, the independent policing boards hold regularly public and private meetings and meet as full committees and sub-committees. They are able to challenge and hold the respective heads of their police forces to account. Further, because they made the appointment they cannot outsource blame for problems that may arise to a quango.

I am highly critical of the local appointments commission, which appoints powerful, influential but untouchable local authority managers who have substantial reserve functions. It is wrong that no one can query or criticise the work of city and county managers. They should be appointed by the members of the local authority they serve, just as an independent policing authority should appoint the Garda Commissioner.

While I am unable to attend the worthwhile consultation exercise planned for Farmleigh, I will send my researcher to the event. On our visit to Northern Ireland and Scotland last week, members of the joint committee learned that the Police Ombudsman for Northern Ireland, Dr. Michael Maguire, had previously been the Chief Inspector of Criminal Justice in Northern Ireland. In this State we have the Inspector of Prisons and Garda Inspectorate, while Northern Ireland and other jurisdictions have an inspectorate that covers the entire criminal justice system, including the courts and office of director of public prosecutions or equivalent. Problems have arisen in this jurisdiction with the Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions. We do not have transparent oversight of the office, nor do we know to what standards it operates. Rather than having separate inspectorates such as the Garda Síochána Inspectorate and Inspector of Prisons, there would be merit in establishing an overarching inspectorate for the entire criminal justice system. Such an entity would also tie in nicely to the proposed independent policing authority.

I do not hold any brief for any of the incumbents or individuals who wish to be appointed to positions in the Garda Síochána. I wish the acting Garda Commissioner, Ms Nóirín O'Sullivan, well in her current capacity. There was a small hiccup at a recent meeting of the Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality and in fairness to the acting Garda Commissioner, having been blind-sided, she put the matter right. She also made a positive start with the whistleblowers. Ms O'Sullivan and all members of An Garda Síochána deserve credit for the fact that crime statistics are moving in the right direction. Unfortunately, recent events have shown that crime is ravaging the streets of parts of Dublin. The shooting of a six year old child shot in a botched, gangland hit in Ballyfermot and an attack on a 16 year old in Clondalkin at the weekend were unbelievable incidents for which there is no justification or excuse. Communities must not tolerate such acts and must support An Garda Síochána.

I ask the Minister to address one point made in a report published today by the Chief Inspector of the Garda Inspectorate, Mr. Bob Olsen. Garda transport is an old chestnut about which Deputies hear regularly because we meet gardaí every day. A multi-annual dedicated budget for fleet management is required in order that the Garda knows how much will be available for capital expenditure on the Garda fleet, which is currently not fit for purpose. As the Minister is aware, with the exception of Dublin and the east coast generally, the population is dispersed and predominately rural. We need a mobile police service to keep people safe.

The Bill is ill thought out and does not make sense given that those who support it also support the establishment of an independent policing authority. One cannot support this legislation while supporting the establishment of an independent policing authority without the most important function of a policing authority, namely, the power to appoint the most senior police officer.

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