Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the opportunity to speak about the Guerin report. It is important that significant steps are taken as a consequence of the report in terms of reforms in the oversight of An Garda Síochána, its management structures and a fundamental review of the force. This review might, perhaps, be similar to the 1970 Conroy review or the review of the nursing commission over a decade ago which led to a sea change for the better in nursing, a change which had to be backed up by resources. The absence of resources is a critical issue for An Garda Síochána.

An Garda Síochána is essential and the core foundation of our democracy. In the emerging state of the 1920s we had the depoliticisation of An Garda Síochána. This took some time - until Eoin Ó Dufaigh moved on - but we will not go through that matter. Nonetheless, a civilian police force has been the bedrock of our democracy through the decades.

Across the world all police forces are not free from problems. However, we should never be of the view that we cannot air or articulate issues for fear of being considered against the Garda. It is important to restore and have public trust in An Garda Síochána, key to which is the belief that any failing will be brought to the fore and dealt with comprehensively. This is essential to maintain faith and trust in the Garda. We must encourage people with evidence of wrongdoing to come forward. If the past 20 years have shown us anything, they have shown there are no institutions beyond criticism. This House has learned lessons also in terms of how it operates and it is important that we set up an independent inquiry. We would appreciate having some input into its terms of reference.

We must also be clear in regard to the determination of the Government and the former Minister for Justice and Equality, Deputy Alan Shatter, to undermine the whistleblowers when they raised issues of consequence. On the ten cases dealt with in the Guerin report, the dossier was sent to the confidential recipient and the Department of Justice and Equality via this route. It was also sent to the Department of the Taoiseach. The cases are shocking. When I met Sergeant Maurice McCabe, I found him to be a credible witness; others who have met him have confirmed this. The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Leo Varadkar, found the same, but it seems he was the only Minister who stood up to the former Minister for Justice and Equality on these issues, particularly the matter of penalty points, which is the reason it ended up with the Road Safety Authority.

On the issue of whistleblowers, what struck me about the transcript of the conversation between the confidential recipient and Sergeant Maurice McCabe becoming public was the absolute silence in this House and the media on its content. I can only hazard a guess as to what would have happened if it had been a Fianna Fáil Minister for justice who was the subject of a transcript of a conversation which reported unacceptable comments made by him and suggested that if he thought a whistleblower was causing him trouble, he would go after him.

We never got a satisfactory explanation for all of that. It is necessary to keep looking at the transcript. Much of the material in the dossier is referred to in that transcript, particularly the treatment of Jerry McGrath and the various offences. An entire chapter in the report deals with that. That led to a murder, and the central proposition is that that murder could have been prevented. That is a very shocking thing. Obviously the commission of investigation to be established will need to go through that and make a call on it. None the less, given the very manner in which that was raised and the details involved in the dossier, one would have thought the reaction would be a desire to get to the bottom of it. However, all along the line the attitude seems to have been not to believe it because it had been properly investigated, and it was pushed to one side. All the other items in that dossier are equally shocking.

While I do not have the transcript with me, I can paraphrase it. The confidential recipient said that the Minister of the day read all of that. The confidential recipient actually had exhibits of each case and the only thing he redacted was the name of Sergeant Maurice McCabe; he left everything else in there. He said that he knew the Minister studied everything. I do not understand why it did not move on from there. That was also Mr. Guerin's central conclusion when he stated that the Minister had opportunities in terms of the legislative provisions in section 42 of the Garda Síochána Act 2005, as amended, and also the function provided for in regulation 82 of the Garda Síochána (Confidential Reporting of Corruption or Malpractice) Regulations 2007. The Minister had the power to establish a special inquiry pursuant to those provisions. In essence, Mr. Guerin is saying that he did not follow through on those provisions, even though he had the capacity to do so.

To be fair, we have not heard the former Minister's side. From his letter of resignation I get the sense that he might have issues. It seems to me that the Taoiseach put the gun to the former Minister's head and said he had to go.

It is interesting to consider the chronology and sequencing of this. The confidential recipient was sacked and there was no debate in the House; no questions were answered in the House on it. The issues in that transcript were very serious and yet for some reason we did not get any accountability as to what had happened and why he was sacked. We then move forward and find that the former Garda Commissioner was to all intents and purposes removed when the Taoiseach sent the Secretary General of the Department of Justice and Equality to the Commissioner's to say, more or less, that he would not survive the following day's Cabinet meeting. The Taoiseach will not be up-front and say that, so he uses all sorts of odd language, saying that he just wanted to let him know how anxious he was about things, despite the fact that the Commissioner had sent letters about those specific issues - the phone-recording situation - to the then Minister two weeks earlier. So we then had the removal of the Commissioner, again without any transparent explanation or proper accountability to the House. The Secretary General of the Department of Justice and Equality is saying he cannot talk to the Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality because of the commission of investigation. The Taoiseach is saying he cannot make a statement to the House about it; he simply will not do it.

Now we have had the removal of the former Minister for Justice and Equality because of this report and, probably, the Taoiseach's reaction to the report. The former Minister said he did not want to cause any further embarrassment to the Government in the run-up to the elections. None of it is good enough. Much of this could have been headed off if there had been far greater transparency in the beginning.

Sergeant Maurice McCabe certainly felt he was got at in the end and that people went after him. However justified, he actually feels that those remarks in the transcript that the former Minister would go after Sergeant McCabe if he thought Sergeant McCabe was causing him trouble are true. The man feels that people went after him and, certainly, anything he was saying was regarded as unwelcome and was basically suppressed. I handed the dossier to the Taoiseach and he responded. He took control of it from the Department of Justice and Equality and appointed Mr. Guerin to do this scoping work and review, and he has published his conclusions.

The fundamental failure of the Government to date is that despite all the language, rhetoric and spin about wanting to be the Government of the democratic revolution, nurturing a culture that facilitates whistleblowers and so on, the opposite actually happened in practice. Whistleblowers now feel worse off because of the Government's behaviour on a series of issues, regardless of what any piece of legislation might do for them.

There have been various provisions in legislation for whistleblowing in recent years on a sectional basis. In other words, if the Department of Health was introducing legislation pertaining to nursing, a whistleblowing provision would always be inserted. A comprehensive Bill is being introduced, but much of that is only rhetoric and spin if it is not matched by action and cultural change. The behaviour and actions of the Government have done more damage to the possibility of people coming forward than any previous Government in my living memory.

I know how important whistleblowing is in the context of health, for example. Probably one of the greatest acts was that of the brave nurses in the Neary scandal at Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital, in which they came forward and told it as it was. They saw things that were radically wrong, with women being butchered. That is how important it is. People might think individuals are oddballs and we should not take heed of them. We need to have proper channels and mechanisms to facilitate people coming forward and also facilitate those against whom allegations are being made in rebutting them if needs be and in making their perspectives known. That is also very important.

We are supportive of the idea of a policing authority but we would like to see some decent research on it so that we end up with something that is fit for purpose. In this House and elsewhere we have a tendency to go herd-like after the next fanciful idea as if it is the panacea for everything, but it is not the panacea for everything. We have a policing authority in Northern Ireland, the Northern Ireland Policing Board. The Patten report was excellent in developing structures of policing in the context of a very conflict-riven society. There are people on policing boards in the North now who, if they do not like who gets arrested, will organise a protest outside the police station. Let us look at a wider sample of different structures in Europe and across the globe to establish what best practice is.

We should also look at the management structures to see if they are fit for purpose in the modern era. We need to look at resources for the Garda. We need to reaffirm our faith and belief in the vast majority of the members of An Garda Síochána who do excellent work every day. We all meet gardaí who are working extremely hard on behalf of all of us in much more difficult circumstances than they did previously, given the challenges and strains of modern society and the consequences of the economic collapse.

We need a policing commission - a similar type of commission - that would look not just at what I might term the negative aspects of recent performances, but also at what a properly and effectively resourced Garda Síochána would look like in 2014 and 2015. The Minister for Finance might have issues with that because of expenditure implications. However, if we are to be fair and honest, we must do that also in terms of the resources available to the Garda, the deployment of the resources and how effective they are against the challenges of society in the 21st century. I believe there is a need for that kind of approach, which would encompass recruitment, education, training, specialist education and continuing professional development. I have met gardaí who get no encouragement or funding to pursue courses and programmes in postgraduate areas or wherever. I often think of what they are up against in the courtrooms. For example, they need to argue their way through developments in the area of forensics and so on. Rewarding people who will go the extra mile to improve themselves through education should be part and parcel of any review.

I was not present for the Minister's initial contribution. I would appreciate it if there could be consultation in respect of the terms of reference of and the timeline relating to the commission of investigation that is to be established. I understand the Minister has been in contact with the acting Garda Commissioner regarding Sergeant McCabe and his access to the PULSE system. I am of the view that Sergeant McCabe should be treated and facilitated in the same way as any other member of An Garda Síochána from now on.

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