Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

When talking about an industry it is easy to cast aspersions and refer to someone having a personal interest. Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan made a very balanced and reasonable contribution when she spoke about the challenges of gambling addiction. I have met people addicted to everything from bingo to scratch cards and whatever. The problem with addictive gamblers is that they will find a way of gambling. It is a major challenge and some of the money collected from this levy should be used to help those who are working with people who suffer from this addiction. As has been pointed out it is a very silent problem and is not very visible. Often the first symptoms are people showing up with incredible debts that are unexplainable based on the rest of their lifestyle and income. Therefore I am disappointed that the control of gambling Bill is not before us in parallel with this Bill. It is very important to keep this issue in mind in the debate.

I have a friend who puts on a bet in a bookie's shop the odd time. He used to say to me that I should look at the floor of a bookie's shop before placing a bet. I asked him why I should do so and he responded by saying I would see all the tickets thrown on the floor from the gamblers who have lost.

The Act we are amending dates from 1931. When one thinks of the technology we have today compared with that available in 1931 it is time to address this issue. It is time to bring the online betting into the mainframe. We will not stop gambling and we will not stop people in the modern world placing bets online. Just as people drink on their own, people can do things in the privacy of their own home that would have been undreamt of many years ago because of the dramatically changing nature of society. Online betting will continue to be a feature of society. In that situation it is much better to deal with it as a mainstream activity rather than deny that it is happening.

I am disappointed that it has taken so long for this Bill to come before the House. We in the previous Government had approved the heads of a Bill. When this Taoiseach took office he said that the Bill would be before the House much sooner than now. Why has it taken 1,000 days to get it this far? This legislation has two purposes, one, to control, license and regulate which is very important. We need to regulate the way that online betting companies operate. The second purpose is that it gives us the chance to raise revenue and the question has been asked what would happen this revenue. Deputy Ó Ríordáin was right that this is unusual. It is a hypothecated revenue, in other words, it effectively goes to one industry although the Department of Finance prefers that money goes into a general pot and it then distributes the money. I am very much in favour not only of introducing the Bill but also of increasing the rate of betting tax, which I believe is very low. It is 5% in Germany, 2.8% in the UK, 3.8% in Italy, 15.5% in France, 7% in Spain, 15% in Bulgaria and 17.5% in Japan. I am not proposing any of those higher rates. We could set a rate of 2.5% or 3%. The online betting companies, the bookmakers, will say that they will fly the country if the Government does that but where will they go? Only tax havens have a lower rate than ours. Every industry, whether the cigarette or drinks industry, will say whenever the Government proposes a tax that it will destroy it and that it will move away but that rarely happens.

Should the money be used for the development of horse and greyhound racing? Should we continue effectively with hypothecation or should it just go into general taxation? Before the money is divided it must be collected. I believe we should raise the tax. We should invest more in horse racing and the sport horse industry, down to dealing with horse issues in urban Ireland. It would be great if we could do that in a way that will not only be self-funding but that the money comes from the Exchequer because the betting tax is not adequate to fund the horse and greyhound racing industry. It would be very sensible to use this extra finance to develop these industries.

The horse industry, from the high end all the way down, is very important to Ireland. We should develop this industry because we have many natural advantages in it. We should never be complacent that our place within the industry will be maintained unless we are willing to invest. Our natural advantages are tradition, technical knowledge, the rain, the grass and many other factors which have given us an incredibly good horse industry. We should do this across the board. Our thoroughbred industry is important worldwide. We are disproportionately large players traditionally in that industry but there is continuing competition from various parts of the world and if we want to retain our place and all the jobs in the industry we must continue to invest in it, including in facilities and services. Many thousands of people are involved with the thoroughbred industry in Ireland. Most of the breeders are not big operators and it is important to support an industry which provides so much employment in rural Ireland.

The sport horse is also very important. To judge by the reports we have received on sport horses they are major contributors to the economy but they are crying out for further investment. That includes the native breeds such as draught horses and Connemara ponies and so on which are associated with this island and have made such a contribution to it. The Connemara pony is indigenous to the region in which I live. Many very ordinary farmers have been engaged in that industry over many years although it faces huge challenges. Many people are attracted to the region because that horse is indigenous. While we are talking about the common agricultural policy programme and the billions of euro to be invested there we need to recognise that it pays equally to invest in horses.

The Minister of State at the Department of Finance, Deputy Brian Hayes, is familiar with the problem of horses in urban areas. That is a major challenge where people have horses in inappropriate settings. There are many things we can do to give people in urban areas who are interested in horses a legitimate and well-managed outlet for getting involved with them, such as the horse projects in Fettercairn and elsewhere. Money from the betting tax could be invested in the horse industry down to that level and the urban horse problem could be resolved by getting funding from the betting tax such as I have proposed.

I understand the ratio is about 90:100 so one could pick the rate to get the extra-----

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