Leo Varadkar (Dublin West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

This has been a very interesting debate and it has been interesting to hear what Deputies have had to say. Deputy Finian McGrath mentioned the specific case of Shane O'Farrell. I do not want to go into too much detail because I am very conscious of the separation of powers between the Legislature and the courts and the fact that the courts have to hear all of the evidence and all of the legal arguments in the case before they make their decision. That is not to say the courts do not get it wrong; they do sometimes, but we cannot overturn what they decide. Also people get off on points of law and technicalities, even when, perhaps, they should not. That is based on our philosophy that when it comes to criminal law, at least in Ireland, one is innocent until proved guilty and that it is better that ten guilty men go free than one innocent man be wrongly convicted. Sometimes I find that philosophy hard to stomach, but that is the basis on which our system works.

Deputy Finian McGrath also asked if the road safety campaigns were working. The evidence shows that they are, as 2012 was the safest year on the roads since records began, although 2013 will see an increase in the number of road fatalities. I hope it will still be the second safest year, although that, probably, will not be the case based on the way the numbers are going. There has been a decrease in the number of serious injuries on the roads this year as compared to last year. It is important, however, not to read too much into any one statistic in any one quarter or year or category. We often see this in economics also. Let us see if a trend is emerging before we assume there is one.

Deputy Catherine Murphy referred to the speed limit review, as a result of which a number of changes are occurring. The process of removing unnecessary signs such as approaching a bend or a roundabout is under way. Probably around summertime on boreens and narrow rural roads the 80 km/h speed limits signs will disappear in favour of the new rural road sign. For the first time, individuals will be allowed to complain to a local authority about a speed limit and have the complaint answered. They will be able to appeal to a national body if they are not happy with the outcome. I will have to check for Deputy Brendan Griffin whether a county council can review a speed limit or introduce a special speed limit on a one-off basis or whether it has to be done as part of a county-wide review. I was not aware that it had to be done as part of a county-wide review and will have to check to see if that is the case.

The speed limit review will cover all roads - national roads and motorways, roads in Dublin, as well as all over the country. There will have to be a review of all speed limits every five years, with the first taking place within the first two years. Sometimes things may not necessarily be as they appear when it comes to speed limits. On a number of occasions I have queried speed limits. Being the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport I tend to notice these things. When I received the explanation as to the why things were the way they were, it actually made sense. Sometimes it is due to the camber or design of the road and at other times the speed limit on a wide road may be low because there is concealed access. Perhaps, if one was not keeping to the speed limit, one might not have noticed that there was concealed access. Even though speed limits sometimes appear absurd, sometimes they are not.

Deputy Catherine Murphy raised the issue of Friday sittings.

I agree with what she said about the approach to Friday sittings. When I was in opposition, I was very frustrated that the Government had too much control over the House, which I think it still does. I have not always been a Minister, nor do I think I always will be one, so it is important that we are, as much as possible, open-minded about backbenchers and Front Bench spokespersons and the contributions they can make to legislation. If we want Deputies to be legislators and to change politics in this country, we must treat them like legislators and respect them as such.

I really hope the first part of this Bill can be incorporated into an amendment. I would be very happy to see that amendment introduced in Deputy Dooley's name on Committee Stage, if he were agreeable, so that the record shows it was his initiative that brought this about. Deputy Eoghan Murphy has a separate Private Members' Bill on other matters, which I hope to bring into law through statutory instrument. I am examining a proposal from Deputy Lawlor to make it a specific offence to clock cars. If possible, I would like to include an amendment on that in the Road Traffic (No. 2) Bill.

In regard to the amendment we hope to frame on foot of this Bill, a particular language is used in the Canadian legislation which states that the law applies to hit-and-runs where it is the intent of the person to escape civil or criminal liability. We would need to work that into it. One could conceive a situation in which somebody knocks a cyclist off his or her bike but he or she gets back on and the person drives on thinking the cyclist is fine. However, the cyclist may have a delayed head injury which only appears two days later. There may be circumstances in which we do not want to fall foul of the law of unintended consequences. The Canadian model is a good one which applies where it is the intent of the person to escape civil or criminal liability.

In regard to testing for intoxicants, I have probably made my case on that. I really have to go with the advice of the Medical Bureau of Road Safety. If it gave me different scientific advice perhaps I might look at it again, but I have to go with its advice.

The comments Deputy Eoghan Murphy made on the maintenance of roads were well made. When road accidents are investigated, very few are found to be down to road conditions, although some are. While I am always arguing for money for, and calling on local authorities to allocate money for, road maintenance, there are huge costs associated with that. However, we also need to bear in mind the huge cost of injuries and accidents on the road. If somebody dies in a road traffic accident, some RSA figures put the cost of that life at over €1 million through lost earnings, lost taxation and so on. That is a huge amount of money, and it is something we need to bear in mind when we look for money for road maintenance.

Over the past few weeks, there have for the first time been a number of prosecutions of cyclists for dangerous cycling, and in one case for drink cycling, which I think was in County Clare. That is the first time we have seen prosecutions of cyclists in the courts, which is very welcome. It is intended to bring in a fixed charge notice system and on-the-spot fines for cyclists as part of the current road safety strategy, although it might be a year or two years before that happens. I do not know whether we will be able to get gardaí to walk people to ATMs. From my discussions with gardaí, I know they are uncomfortable about handling cash and are not willing to go down that route at the moment, although it is done in other countries.

Deputy Stanley mentioned texting and driving, which is extremely dangerous. We will make that tighter in the Bill by making it an offence to even handle or operate a telephone in a car, but the difficulty in prosecuting that offence is that it will have to be witnessed. A garda will probably have to see the person doing it, and that is why enforcement is very difficult.

I would like to see more enforcement, but the gardaí are doing a very good job with the resources they have; they are doing a robust job in enforcement. Deputy Stanley mentioned that there is a perception that enforcement is down. That is a problem in itself because the most effective way to ensure people comply with the law is for them to believe they will be caught if they do not. The perception that enforcement is down, which research shows, worries me.

Deputy McNamara asked about the location of speed cameras. They are decided on by the gardaí. I have been told they are in accident black spots, but people have told me that is not always the case. It is probably worth inquiring directly with the gardaí about the accident record in that spot to see if they are warranted. Speed cameras are definitely not revenue-making, as the Garda loses approximately €1 million or €2 million per year on them. It may make money from some and not from others but, on the whole, it is not a money-spinner or a revenue generator. The Garda actually loses on them.

Deputy Griffin, in his interesting contribution, asked a philosophical question about the acceptable level of deaths on our roads. The only way to get to zero is to abolish vehicles altogether but, obviously, we will not do that. We have to ask ourselves what measures we can bring in to further reduce the number of fatalities, collisions and injuries on the roads.

Deputy Griffin mentioned speed limiters on cars. That technology exists. We will trial something different as part of the speed limit review. I think in 20 years' time the satellite navigation system in one's car will give one the speed limit and start to beep if one goes over it. Although it might be a bit Big Brother-ish, in time the satnav will probably be able to tell the Garda that one is driving over the speed limit. Perhaps that is where we will be in 20 years' time.

Deputy Griffin also mentioned alco-locks. Interestingly enough, some of the private bus operators have already introduced alco-locks on their buses. The driver has to blow into it to ensure he is not intoxicated before he can drive the bus. Perhaps that will spread to other areas. I would not like to impose those things on everyone in society, but as part of the current strategy we will allow the courts to do so. If somebody has been convicted of dangerous driving or has been taken off the road for a period of time, the courts could, as a sanction, state that person must have his or her car governed or must have an alco-lock installed. At the other end of the spectrum, people would be able to go on a safe driving course rather than take penalty points, which is done in the UK and other places and seems to be very successful, particularly for younger drivers and those with a first conviction.

I have probably covered the contributions made and I thank Deputies for a very interesting and welcome debate.

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