Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank all Deputies for the points they raised. This is always about time and the capacity for everybody to have an opportunity to say their piece in respect of Dáil reform. Over the years, I have seen situations where Ministers came in to answer questions. The Minister for Agriculture might be in possession for six months before anybody else because the questions just kept rolling through. Thus, a Minister might answer from September or October right through until March. We have made a lot of changes and there have also been some good suggestions, some of which are already under way. I want Deputies to understand that I am serious about this matter. What we introduce for this session and the next is not permanent. We would like to have a situation whereby we try things and see how they can work in the best interests of all Deputies. When we do make changes they are, of necessity, to be tried and we will continue with those that work best. That is why we have Leaders' Questions on Thursdays, which the Tánaiste takes. Topical Issues have replaced the outdated and outmoded Adjournment Debate. Friday sittings are for Deputies to introduce their own Bills, and we have never had that before, except in Private Members' time. It is a good innovation.

I am open to the question Deputy Lawlor raised about Friday sittings. Who attends and do we have real debates on Committee Stage of Bills? We could always put the votes off until Tuesday if necessary. There is always a problem with Deputies from around the country who are not able to attend the House on Fridays. It is an issue that has always been raised by them.

I assure Deputies concerning the restructuring of the Oireachtas committees that we want to continue with the pre-legislative review. The engagement with civic society is important, as was evidenced in a number of Bills recently. As regards Deputy Kyne's point, that will not be watered down. It will require the engagement of Ministers with Opposition spokespersons. Committee chairmen will ask how many hearings are needed and how long they will last. They are not dictated to by government. The chairman and other members of the committee will decide what organisations and individuals to call to provide experience whatever the case might be. Some Bills are short, comprising a few lines of amendment, so they may not require any hearings at all. By contrast, the Companies Bill had 1,800 sections and was five years in gestation. That was a very different matter. Bills, therefore, can range from being simple to complex. That system of scrutiny will not be watered down. Committee chairs will have a role in engaging with civic society.

We also want to move on so that committees can examine the stability programme update in respect of the budget. When the forthcoming budget is over, I expect the committees will engage with Ministers on departmental Votes and Estimates, as well as what their spending priorities are and how effective that expenditure will be. Hopefully, this will all be televised and streamed live so that the public is fully engaged on what is being spent on their behalf by different Departments.

I would like to think that we can arrive at a situation whereby chairmen and Opposition spokespersons can work with Ministers on Bills. Unless it is emergency legislation, it should not be rushed. I wish to allow for proper debate here but I do not want people to play games and seek extra time just for the sake of it. It must be recognised that this is the Dáil and it is the Opposition's duty to hold the Government to account. We must provide people with the facilities to do that.

We had committee weeks before and they did not work. We may look at that again. We devoted a week to particular committees in the Chamber as distinct from being in committee rooms. People said they liked it but it did not work.

Deputies have raised valid points. Some people mentioned the Whip vote but I have been in Governments where there was a minority situation, or very close to it. One cannot have instability. What might be one person's crisis of conscience is another's political crisis. I see an opportunity when the heads of a Bill are being discussed on Committee Stage whereby people could give their view irrespective of whether it is in accordance with Government philosophy or not. When one signs on for a Government Bill as Government Members, one will be expected to support that. The issue of stability is important for international investors when they look at the country. In a tight future election outcome, for example, people may ask whether the Government will be able to continue in office. Without stability, one cannot have investment.

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