John Paul Phelan (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I support the legislation and agree with many of the comments made by speakers on both sides of the House. Regardless of whether they were all served, the fact that last year over 8,000 people received some form of prison sentence in respect of the non-payment of fines is quite startling. Deputy Boyd Barrett referred to people choosing the option of going to prison rather than paying fines. The latter has a significant impact on the individuals involved and gives rise to a significant cost to the Exchequer. I welcome the Bill because it will change the position in this regard. I am sure all Members are of the view that people who do not pay fines, whether by choice or because they cannot afford to do so, should not end up in prison and that attachment of earnings and community service orders offer a much more effective way of ensuring that justice will be served.

I wish to focus on community service orders, which are imposed in a very haphazard way throughout the country at present. Is some areas significantly more of these orders are put in place than is the case elsewhere.

Deputy Stanton referred to work his committee will undertake in the near future in regard to the community court system which is prevalent in New York and which has worked to a very startling extent in that city. Recidivism among people who have appeared before the community court has dropped from 80% to 18% since its introduction. People are tracked for up to six months after appearing before the community court and, if they do not get into any difficulty in that period of time, their file is sealed and it is not something which can be held against them at a later date. There is much scope for additional legislation in that area in this jurisdiction. People should not go to jail for the non-payment of television licences and traffic fines.

A few days ago, a leading national commentator spent a couple of hours in prison as a result of a traffic offence. Some might argue it was a little bit of a stunt on the part of that person and one could argue that it was a misuse of State resources that somebody would spend a few hours in prison to discharge his or her liability, having gone through courts and prison system. That is why this legislation is really important.

I agree with Deputy Stanton's comments on the possibility of deductions from social welfare payments, in particular for smaller fines, although it is a controversial area. The Department of Social Protection is in a position to look for money back when overpayments are made to those in receipt of social welfare. A small contribution over a long period of time to ensure somebody does not end up in prison should happen. Failing that, a more effective community service order regime should ensure such people never end up in prison for non-payment of fines.

Deputy Mattie McGrath and others raised the issue of sheriffs and debt collection. There is no doubt the tactics being used by individuals operating for some of the leading financial institutions in this country leave a lot to be desired. I know it is not an area with which this Bill deals specifically but it is something which cannot continue. Some of these bully boy tactics are not appropriate and I hope the Minister will address that particular area in the near future.

See this speech in context