Dáil debates

Thursday, 20 June 2013

An Bille um an Dara Leasú is Tríocha ar an mBunreacht (Deireadh a Chur le Seanad Éireann) 2013: Second Stage (Resumed) - Thirty-second Amendment of the Constitution (Abolition of Seanad Éireann) Bill 2013: Second Stage (Resumed)

 

5:05 pm

Photo of Michael MoynihanMichael Moynihan (Cork North West, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the opportunity to speak in this debate. This Bill is the result of an off-the-cuff commitment given in 2009 that the Seanad would be abolished.

The public tends to support any proposal to get rid of politicians but the democratic process across the world has also been a vehicle for change. The European Parliament is a good example of this. Brussels is built around the European Parliament. It is almost a city of bureaucracy. When we implement the various directives from Europe and have to explain to communities, including in particular the farming community, the nature of bureaucracy in Europe, we tend to overlook the value of the European Parliament. I once had a conversation with an official from the Parliament who told me that the bureaucracy beats war. The Parliament was born out of the ruins of the Second World War and the other conflicts that tore Europe apart over the previous century.

In the run-up to the Second World War, the Wall Street crash of 1929 caused difficulties across the world and created massive poverty. People took polarised positions on the extremes of the right and left. Many asked whether democracy was the right form of government or if an alternative system would have avoided the financial morass of the time. Some looked to dictatorships or other alternatives to democracy. However, democracy has stood the test of time despite its faults. Even now, the Americans are speaking to extremists in Afghanistan and elsewhere to try to build a democratic political process. We have enjoyed the enormous benefits of the democratic process on our island.

We have seen how the extremes in Northern Ireland have co-operated in the Assembly and in town and borough councils and made decisions that serve the community.

It is easy to propose to abolish this, that or the other when newspapers run articles on the salaries and expenses of politicians in local authorities and the Dáil, Seanad and European Parliament. The age-old approach is to propose to abolish something because one will get a clap on the back from media commentators and appease a certain section of society. Unfortunately, the issue is much more serious than that. By extension, the proposal to abolish the Seanad casts aspersions on the way in which the Seanad has operated over the past 75 years and raises questions about the contribution the Upper House has made to society. Speakers referred to the great contributions made by former Senators in challenging the status quoon social and economic issues. All modern democracies must have a place for second chamber, although I accept the case for Seanad reform.

Seanad Éireann, as structured under the 1937 Constitution, had great potential as a second Chamber. I come from Kiskeam, a village in north County Cork which was also the birthplace of Sean Moylan, one of the first Senators to be appointed to the Cabinet. Sean Moylan made a major contribution during his period as a Minister and Senator. The former Taoiseach, the late Garret FitzGerald, subsequently appointed Senator James Dooge to the position of Minister for Foreign Affairs in early 1981.

The Minister has proposed to abolish town councils, whose contribution to local communities has not been acknowledged. For example, some of them have vigorously marketed the tourism and commercial identity of their locality. Everything has weaknesses but we must also focus on strengths. As other speakers noted, if we were to hold referendums on the abolition of the Dáil, the President or the European Parliament, they would probably be passed and democracy would be finished. One of the lessons of history is that the democratic process has served the world extremely well. For this reason, we should strengthen democratic principles and institutions. In the case of Seanad Éireann, the electoral system should be reformed and the House should use its potential to improve representation for minorities.

The bottom-up approach taken to Leader funding when the programme was introduced in rural communities in the early 1990s has stood the test of time. One has to question whether, under the changes the Minister has introduced to Leader, the programme will be able to serve communities as well as it has done for the past 20 years. The Minister should reconsider his proposals.

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