Barry Cowen (Laois-Offaly, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

Like Deputy Stanley, I am disappointed that many of the amendments have been ruled out of order. Having said that, I wish to raise the point being made specifically within these amendments in respect of the poverty-proofing issue. To elaborate on this, it is necessary to revert to the costs associated with setting up Irish Water. To that end, I sought on Committee Stage confirmation and exact figures on Irish Water. We have no objection in principle to the concept of water charging but we do object to the absence of information on the setting up of Irish Water and the costs associated with it. Can it be confirmed, in the first instance, that the cost to the State of water metering will be €500 million? A figure of between €300 million and €500 million has been mentioned, and the legislation caps the figure at €500 million. This means that the cost, at the high end, could be €500 million. Can the Minister of State confirm this?

Where is the commitment given by Bord Gáis when it got the contract to carry out a full audit of the networks throughout the country? It promised to put on paper a commitment to rectification, reinstatement and making the network fit for purpose. This promise, in addition to its billing network, is partly why it won the contract rather than Bord na Móna. I would have believed Bord Gáis would have been able to stand up to that commitment. It has not done so to date, yet we find ourselves discussing what has been described as an "interim Bill". It is an effort to give some indication of progress having been made in this regard in the absence of all the required legislation coming before the House. I would much rather, in the late autumn, that we were discussing the whole Bill with knowledge of the total cost and all the ramifications, rather than expecting Members to vote in the dark. The latter is what we are doing.

Let me return to the figures. In the absence of an audit, can the Minister of State, who is as much in the dark as I am, confirm the cost of making the network fit for purpose throughout the country? Will it be another €500 million? Will the Minister of State confirm Bord na Móna's figure in regard to rectification in Dublin? Is the cost €500 million?

Deputy Stanley referred to existing national maintenance costs, in respect of which the figures vary. Do these costs amount to approximately €700 million? I am not using the highest estimate. As I stated on Committee Stage in respect of counties Laois, Offaly and Westmeath, the current maintenance costs are in the region of €12 million per annum. With approximately 20,000 houses in each of those counties, the cost is approximately €600 per household. This is the existing cost and it results in a total of €2.2 billion, which does not include the new maintenance cost or the provision for the directives in regard to having upgraded and reinstated networks. Over time, the upgrading and reinstatement costs are expected to diminish but the front-loading cost will be quite high.

With regard to the call centre, the sop is that 400 jobs are being created. I am sure there is a skirmish around the Cabinet table over where the centre is to be located. As has been said, the simple fact of the matter is that we have call centres in every county at present. We have expertise and local knowledge of the networks as we know them.

Contrast what happened north and south of the Border some years ago during the big freeze. A body similar to that which the Minister of State proposes to set up was put up in place in the North and it was not able to deal with the complexities and difficulties arising from what happened at the time. The favourable reaction, commitment and dedication of the staff in the local authorities throughout the country to the public was plain to be seen over the Christmas in question. I availed of their services, having been out of water for two weeks.

When will we have the audit? Will it be ready before the next Bill is introduced? When will we know the costs and have confirmation? The Minister of State may rubbish the figures I have given him. Is it proper and fair to proceed to establish Irish Water in the absence of the figures?

What is the Government's position on the service agreement with local authorities and the existing staff, for example? The Minister of State mentioned on Committee Stage that Irish Water would enter into service agreements for a two-year period?

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