Pat Deering (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I am delighted to get the opportunity to speak on the Bill. I agree with the previous speaker that the Bill represents a missed opportunity for overall reform. We have seen some reform with the abolition of State cars for some Ministers, the proposed reduction in the number of Deputies and the change to ministerial pensions in the future. However, overall reform should have been within the Dáil itself.

I wish to concentrate on an area mentioned by previous speakers, the breach of county boundaries. In his contribution, Deputy Colreavy said he campaigned at the last general election to have County Leitrim reunited in one constituency, and I compliment him on his success in that regard. In Carlow I campaigned on a similar strategy to reunite County Carlow in one constituency. It is the second smallest county in the country with a population of 55,000 people. Unfortunately 5,000 of those people live in the constituency of Wicklow-East Carlow as it is now called. Those people feel alienated because they cannot participate in their own county. Deputy Ó Cuív mentioned how passionate the Mayo people and Galway people were. The people of Carlow are as proud and passionate about the county jersey as those of any other county and deserve to be part of the one county.

The counties of Carlow and Kilkenny are in the southern area from a HSE point of view and are in the same VEC area. However, at the same time the people of east Carlow have to be part of a constituency that is in the Dublin area from a HSE point of view and in the midland area from a VEC point of view, and they feel totally alienated in that regard. When people are alienated they opt out of the political system, which is very dangerous. It is important to involve people as much as possible in the political system because if we do not, we create a vacuum, which is very dangerous. In the last general election we had one of the highest turnouts for some time. The voter turnout in the Carlow-Kilkenny constituency was 70.7% and the turnout in Wicklow-East Carlow was 74.8%. However, the voter turnout in Wicklow, excluding east Carlow was 75%. The voter turnout in east Carlow, which is now alienated, was only 63.8%, a damning statistic in itself. People who are alienated do not want to involve themselves in the political system. If that dangerous situation is not addressed, that figure will continue to drop. Some 9% of the population are left out and not consulted on all matters.

We are continually compared with the UK where the Members of Parliament, once they are elected, are probably not seen for the following three, four or five years. In Ireland the Deputy or Senator is very much on the ground with his or her constituents, which is very important. If a Deputy or Senator loses touch with his or her constituents, it would be very regressive, and it is important we ensure that does not happen.

County boundaries should be maintained, if at all possible. Deputy Griffin mentioned the Bill he recently introduced whereby the county boundary would not be breached and there would be a number of constituencies. That is an important step and should be considered. The present constituency boundary review is based on figures alone, but as we know there are lies, damned lies and statistics. Nothing else was taken into consideration, including the geographic location and county boundaries. At the end of the day one cannot even appeal what the commission has decided. It is important that we have an independent review commission, but every aspect of the county and constituency should be taken into consideration.

The former American politician, Tip O'Neill, said that all politics is local. There is nothing wrong with Deputies being asked to fill a pothole or fix a light. I accept their primary role is to legislate and that is what they are elected to do. If we lose track of what is happening on the ground, we will leave a dangerous vacuum in society which will not be addressed in the political system. I have concerns that a number of county boundaries are being breached. We have heard a great deal about County Leitrim in the past. Apparently on this occasion, because there were so many submissions from that area of the country, they eventually got what they wanted, and fair play to them. In County Carlow, 700 or 800 people signed a petition seeking to be reunited with the rest of County Carlow, but unfortunately their views were not heard on this occasion. Do they need to put in 5,000 submissions on the next occasion in order to get what they want? Is it he who shouts the loudest gets the most? We are creating a dangerous situation in that regard.

Overall we are moving in a certain direction, reducing the number of Deputies. There will be considerable reform at local level. Democracy will be on a smaller scale in the future, which is of some concern. I know we need to scale back somewhat, but we cannot do away with democracy at all costs just because it is the popular thing to say or do. We need democracy and it is a cost that is worth bearing. I hope the Minister will take on board some of my views, particularly those on county boundaries. Even though on this occasion the people of Carlow will still feel very disappointed, perhaps on future occasions their voices may be heard.

See this speech in context