Dáil debates

Friday, 7 December 2012

Report of the Expert Group on the Judgment in the A, B and C v. Ireland Case: Statements (Resumed)

 

2:10 pm

Photo of Eric ByrneEric Byrne (Dublin South Central, Labour) | Oireachtas source

This is the first time I have spoken on this issue but it is a matter of such importance, nationally and internationally, that it would be remiss of me not to spend some time dealing with the situation that obtains in Ireland today. I am slightly older than the previous speaker, who covered most of the points in great depth. However, in the Ireland of the 1980s, women often did not trust and were so terrified of having their babies in maternity hospitals with a so-called Catholic ethos that many preferred to travel to the Rotunda Hospital in Dublin because of its so-called Protestant ethos. Women felt more reassured that they would get better life-saving response and treatment there in a crisis situation. That was a widely held view in the 1980s among those of us who knew there was a distinct difference in ethos between the Catholic maternity hospitals and the Rotunda Hospital, Dublin.

Imagine that in those days, worried women were obliged to travel to Belfast to have amniocentesis tests because of their lack of availability in the Republic. That was 30 years ago and one would have imagined that our maternity hospitals would have progressed to a point where the life of Savita Halappanavar would have been saved and no one could have cited as an excuse that this is a Catholic country. That was the Ireland into which my children, aged 32 and 30, were born, yet here Members are, having this inconclusive and ongoing debate again, for which they need finality.

I believe the hypocrisy and indignity of forcing women from this country to travel to England for a termination, including a 14 year old suicidal rape victim, is an obscenity and a blot on the image of Ireland both nationally and internationally. Ireland is indeed an overwhelmingly Catholic nation, and the recently completed census shows that 84% of the people in the Republic proclaim themselves to be Catholic. However, Members also must note that now more than ever before, Ireland is a highly diverse society. As legislators, they must legislate for the nation as a whole and not just for the religious moral teachings of one faith. Ireland now is a multi-faith society and Members must legislate for such.

It might be useful to put on record what constitutes the Ireland of 2012. Members might note that the group nearest in number to Catholics are those who declare themselves as having no religion.

They now number 269,000, an increase of 44.8% over the 2006 census figure. A further 73,000 people do not state their religion, which would be indicative of an open-minded collective. Among those who did declare their religion last year, the next largest grouping to those with no religion are members of the Church of Ireland at 130,000, members of the Presbyterian Church, which have increased 4.5% to 24,600, and Jehovah's Witnesses, which stand at more than 6,000 people.

The most significant non-Christian religion in Ireland is Islam, with members of the Irish Muslim community now representing approximately 50,000 people. That is a big increase of 52% over the figure from 2006. Hindus are important in this debate, as it has as a backdrop to the case of Ms Savita Halappanavar, who was Hindu. Their numbers have grown by almost 76% to approximately 11,000. Ireland also has a Buddhist and Jewish population, among other groups.

I respect absolutely the right of the five bishops and their congregations to picket the Dáil but we should not, as legislators, attempt to legislate for one faith or the morals of one religious grouping. We must legislate for an open, diverse and multicultural society, and I remind those who practice Roman Catholicism that no Catholic with a moral belief need avail of such services that may be available to those who do not believe that life commences at the moment of fertilisation, which is the Roman Catholic Church position. I believe very strongly that, in a modern liberal democracy, we as legislators must not impose in laws the singular view of one faith group.

I will not spend too much time going over the details of what has happened in the past in Ireland. Deputy Ó Ríordáin mentioned some and I have quickly perused the report of the expert group, so it strikes me that one group does not appear to matter in this country, aside from the women whose lives are threatened. I am talking about the families of such women, including mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, partners and extended family. They are mainly excluded from these debates. There is the case of Ms D, who brought Ireland to court. She discovered after 14 weeks of pregnancy that one of the twins she carried had died in the womb and the other had a lethal foetal abnormality, Edwards syndrome. In all humility I ask how the religious and pro-life groups are arguing that women like this should be compelled to continue the pregnancy when she, her husband, her family, her mother or father, her aunts, uncles and grandparents may have decided, with her agreement, to abort.

Another woman brought a case against the Health Service Executive. She was four months pregnant at the time of the hearing and had learned that the foetus had a neural tube defect resulting in the absence of a major portion of the brain, with the condition usually fatal within three days of birth. I wonder how insensitive this society has been to mothers, husbands, children and families that we have not, over 20 years, improved the circumstances where a woman can go into a maternity hospital and feel absolutely secure that if she and her family make a decision that a foetus is dead in the womb, she will not have to continue the pregnancy. It is an obscenity and we as legislators should pull out our fingers and begin legislating for women and their partners as a collective.

The five bishops had an amazingly excited audience of pro-life group members so hysterical in their extreme views that they were the mirror image of the groups demonstrating two days earlier which sought abortion on demand. These extreme groups were screeching, hysterical and mind-boggling. One group was led by five Roman Catholic bishops and the other was led by ultra-leftists, Trotskyists, Éirigi and radical feminists. These groups constitute the extremes, but we have a mandate as democrats in a liberal democracy to ensure we do not interpret their views but accept that we have a maturity in Parliament to implement legislation for the betterment of any mother using our maternity services.

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