Billy Kelleher (Cork North Central, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

At a time when wording of the constitutional amendment on children is being published, it is appropriate that we are speaking about a very solid proposal on vetting procedures that will protect children and vulnerable people. The Minister also said that it is about protecting those in positions of trust and ensuring that they have adequate training and knowledge of their obligations. Nor should they be compromised by allegation or not being aware of their obligations. Clearly getting that balance right is a very important part of the legislation.

We need to ensure that we have not only children's rights but also the resources to ensure those rights are upheld, vindicated and protected. We often pass legislation purporting to do something but the mechanics and workings of it are critical. Resourcing should be made available to provide training and information to organisations and individuals working in the community on a voluntary basis, on boards of management in community centres, on community employment schemes and all the other normal activities that happen every day. Proper information campaigns need to be put in place outlining the obligations of the employer and employee in the vetting procedure. There also needs to be training in the area of child care and dealing with vulnerable people.

Clearly the legislation is welcome. Obviously we have concerns that it is not sufficiently broad to deal with child minding, which we regard as a deficiency in the legislation. We all know that paedophilia is a predatory and devious activity. As the Minister has acknowledged, changes in technology have meant that predatory profiling has gone to Internet grooming and using that as a mechanism to build up trust with a vulnerable person or a child. As child minding takes place in the home it is very hard to police in the first place. However, we feel this should be kept under observation because cutting off potential predatory avenues may result in people going elsewhere in order to inflict abuse on children or vulnerable people.

Overall the National Vetting Bureau (Children and Vulnerable Persons) Bill 2012 is welcome and sits alongside other legislative measures that have been introduced and others that are on the way, including the Children First legislation. We also need procedures ensuring a streamlining of vetting. While this is not the fault of An Garda Síochána, because there was not uniformity regarding vetting across the country for many years there were delays in vetting individuals to determine if they were suitable for paid positions of employment. We have all come across cases of people waiting extraordinary lengths of time to take up employment because the vetting procedure did not happen as quickly as one would anticipate. That will now be streamlined with a co-ordinated centre in Thurles with an information flow into that centre. The proper supports in technology, software and computers as well as personnel resourcing need to be maintained to ensure this legislation is effective as opposed to conferring another right on people which is not vindicated or protected.

Unfortunately many hours in this House have been taken up in discussing the many reports of abuse inflicted on young people over many decades by various institutions, including the church, that were entrusted with their care. In many cases the State abdicated its responsibility for children, which had a very damaging impact on many people. These include not only the abused and their immediate families, but also us as a people. We failed to look after the most vulnerable in our society. The constitutional amendment on children's rights could form part of that healing process by putting the child first and at the centre of everything and then having legislation, such as this Bill, in place to ensure those rights are vindicated and upheld and children are protected by every effort of the State. For all those reasons it is important.

We also need to be conscious that many people volunteer for a school day or a community association fund-raising night. There needs to be clarity on the obligations organisations have. Without clarity on the obligations in order to comply with this and other legislation, people may just put up the barriers completely and not go ahead with everyday events such as garden fetes and other fund-raising events for schools and community centres. Some years ago community associations cancelled various fund-raising and community events because they could not get public liability insurance or were unsure about the liability contingent on individuals or organisations if something happened.

I am concerned that if this is not properly explained and validated in a concise manner organisations will seek to comply with this legislation and other legislation and may not, because they believe it is too onerous, engage in what is considered normal every day community activity. It is important in terms of protecting children and vulnerable people and informing people and organisations of their obligations that we achieve a balance so as to ensure people do not believe onerous obligations are being placed upon them resulting in their not taking up work in communities and volunteering on a regular basis, as is currently a normal part of everyday life in Ireland.

The Health Information and Quality Authority, HIQA, is responsible for inspecting nursing homes in terms of fire exits, facilities, medication and quality of medical service provided to patients. We must be conscious that many people in nursing homes are vulnerable people. There is an obligation on all the statutory authorities who oversee these facilities to ensure that the inspection process not alone addresses patient safety in terms of fire, medication, food and so on but personal integrity. This area needs to be monitored. HIQA is at the front line in terms of ensuring standards are maintained in nursing homes. Given the increasing demographic profile of our people and the move towards private nursing home care, we may have to revisit this legislation in terms of the provision of further resources to HIQA and the putting in place of stronger links between it and the vetting bureau. There will be a need for continual observation to ensure this area is not forgotten about and there is proper centralised inspection of individuals, not alone in terms of vetting but of inspection. We may have to revisit this issue at a later stage if this particular legislation is found to be slightly impaired in terms of ensuring inspections are part and parcel of the process in the area of long term care.

I referred earlier, as did the Minister, to the issue of social workers and employees of the Health Service Executive. I believe we are hugely under-resourced in this area. That is an observation rather than a political point. There is now much emphasis on the assessment of families under stress and duress for many reasons and at risk owing to addiction, dysfunction and mental capacity. We need to revisit the issue of social workers and supports for families and individuals within those families who are at risk. All too often, we hear of cases involving children whose lives have been taken or of a parent who has taken his or her life and that of his or her children. I wonder if in this regard the link between schools, social workers and the HSE is strong enough in terms of the provision of a mechanism that is proactive in dealing with this issue. I am aware that this matter will be central to the debate on the forthcoming children's rights referendum. However, at the heart of this issue is resources and rights. We can confer rights on people by way of legislation or through changes to the Constitution but the key issue is the provision of resources for those on whom we confer those rights. There remains substantial difficulties in terms of social workers' interaction with families and individuals within those families who are vulnerable and at risk. This is not an issue in respect of children only. There have been many cases involving a person with an intellectual, physical or mental disability who has been abused or neglected by a family member in the home. This is a key issue with which we must deal, one which will require extensive resourcing.

The Garda Síochána may receive information which is then passed on to social workers in the HSE, many of whom are working under huge pressure. We need a 24/7 care system in place. A social worker once told me that she goes home on a Friday evening hoping that when she returns to work on Monday there will have been no change in circumstances over the weekend. It is hoped that the deficiencies in this area, not alone in respect of rights and legislation but of resourcing, will be highlighted during the debate on the forthcoming referendum. We must assist those who need support. In this regard, I am speaking not only of a particular individual who may need support but of whole families who require intervention. Intervention can take make forms. The saddest intervention is when the hearse arrives at the house to take away a family member because of the failure not necessarily of individuals but of the system to provide assistance and supports.

I hope that in future there will be assistance available 24/7 so that when the Garda or HSE receive reports or teachers perceive, in school or through local contact, a potential threat to an individual the system can move immediately to address it rather than having to wait until the following Monday or Tuesday when a social worker is available. Such a service will be expensive and social workers, who are a professional group of people, are in short supply. Nevertheless, we need to roll out this support service to vulnerable families in our communities. The number of people at risk and under huge pressure because of changed circumstances in the economy and society has increased, resulting in alcohol abuse, drug addiction and so on which can have a devastating impact on individuals and society.

In speaking about vetting, children's rights and the protection of vulnerable people the emphasis must always be on ensuring that what we say in here, in terms of our aspirations to confer rights and protections, is backed up with resources. On the issue of childminders, I am concerned that this Bill does not adequately address this area. Many children are cared for by childminders in the home. This legislation is deficient in terms of addressing this issue. There is a need for ongoing monitoring in this area. The Bill should include a reference to the vetting of childminders and in this regard the Minister should revisit it immediately.

It is often too late when we realise key areas of legislation were not enacted or resources were not put in place to develop a particular area. While this legislation is being rolled out and resources are being rolled out behind it, we should be mindful of the issue of childminders. If one were to add up all the people who are solely dependent on an individual in a trusting way on a daily basis, the area of childminding would be a key one where there are no other observations in place. In most other cases, in nursing home settings, even in community centres, schools and hospitals, there are more people in the vicinity and in the work environment but in the home setting the childminder is at the centre of it, as entrusted by a parent or parents to mind children for a period of time when nobody else is present. That is something we need to observe and keep a very close eye on. Given the predatory nature of paedophilia, when one avenue is closed off, other avenues are explored by those people. There is considerable evidence internationally that shows this to be the case. Very often, as we have found to our cost here, the offender may not be a childminder from outside the family environment but one from within it, a relative or a person closer to the family than the traditional mindset people would have of a person who would work as a childminder.

In regard to the passing on of soft information to people in the Garda vetting bureau, the purpose of the Garda Síochána is to maintain the peace, protect our citizens and all that flows form that. If there is evidence or suggestions that an individual may not be suitable to be placed in such a role, there is an obligation on people to pass on that information, even it is soft or anecdotal in nature, as it would give the Garda intelligence to assess a situation and deal with it.

We welcome the Bill. There are key settings in the area of child protection in particular, childminding and nursing homes that we might have to monitor and observe. On the day of the launch of the wording of the children's rights referendum, the key issue is not only do we confer rights but we confer those rights and entitlements through ensuring proper resources are made available to protect children and vulnerable persons in our community.

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