Willie O'Dea (Limerick City, Fianna Fail)

It ill behoves the Minister of State to say the time for policy-based discussions is at an end. The delay in respect of this legislation have been exclusively on the Government side. To date, there has been a delay of 15 or 16 months. All I am seeking is that we engage in a policy-based discussion, which might take no more than a couple of hours, before the scheme is finally signed off on. Surely, holding such a discussion will not make any material difference in the context of when the scheme is going to come into operation.

I wish to correct the Minister of State in respect of a few points. I accept that Members were invited to contact departmental officials regarding any matters they would like to see contemplated by the scheme. I already made a number of suggestions in respect of the scheme on Second Stage and Committee Stage. I sent copies of those to the officials in the Department. In addition, some of those officials were present for the debates on the Bill and heard what I had to say. In such circumstances, I do not believe I should be obliged to go through the process of contacting them again. It is not just a question of contacting the officials of the Department while a scheme is being prepared. I am seeking that the House, as represented by the Select Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, should be in a position to see the final version of what the Government is proposing, to discuss it and the merits and demerits of various proposals relating to it, and to have an input in respect of it. Is that not what we do here all the time in any event? If we take the Minister of State's logic to its ultimate conclusion, it would mean we would be invited to make submissions in advance of legislation being produced but that when the latter is finally introduced, we would not be in a position to make any further comment on it.

The idea behind debate and discussion is that everyone has an input into the final product. With respect, the Minister of State and his Department do not have a monopoly of wisdom. I informed my party colleagues that I would not call a vote on this amendment. I am seriously tempted to press it to a vote now but I will not do so. I am flabbergasted by the Minister of State's comment to the effect that the scheme will not be debated. If he does not want to accept the amendment, that is fine and I will not press the matter to a vote. His boss, the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, Deputy Bruton, unequivocally informed us on Committee Stage - we can access the record in this regard - that the committee would have an opportunity to debate the scheme when it was produced. Unless my memory has completely deserted me, that is precisely what the Minister stated. I will check the record shortly to confirm that. Is the Minister of State indicating there will not be any facility provided in order that the scheme might be discussed? That is what I understood him to say. I would like clarification on that matter.

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