Catherine Murphy (Kildare North, Independent)

I am referring to primary level. Class sizes in schools in these areas are always proportionately larger than the national average. Therefore, the use of the historical model for calculating school numbers needs to be questioned if one wishes to have a fair system, in particular where there are large class sizes and where there is a need for expertise for dealing with children with disabilities but this may not be available. I predict that some areas will be disadvantaged by virtue of the growth in those areas.

The Bill will determine the responsibility for speech and language therapy. However, the practical delivery of this service is a different matter. I ask if the Minister has talked to the HSE about those therapies. The services are threadbare and the lopsided nature of them can mean that a child's address determines whether that service is available to a child in that particular area. For example, a few years ago, I asked for the figures on the distribution and waiting times for speech and language therapy services. There was a waiting time of two months in one part of the country while it was two and a half years in another part of the country. A three year old child requiring speech and language therapy who must wait on a list for therapy until the age of five, starts school with an automatic disadvantage and the remediation needed is then significantly different. The statutory responsibility is one aspect but the delivery is an entirely different matter and this depends on a fair distribution of that expertise.

I have concerns about the equal opportunities for teachers as regards the new system. In the past, it was an advantage to teachers to acquire further qualifications in areas such as maths and science, for example. I am concerned that teachers would be discouraged from acquiring the kind of skills we will need in schools.

I refer to the provision in the Bill regarding the Department being in a position to dismiss teachers. I will deal with this provision on Committee Stage. The Bill provides that procedures will be established following consultation with the relevant stakeholders rather than requiring agreement. This worries me although I acknowledge this is in the context of the Croke Park agreement because one must be certain of what is involved in any case of dismissal to ensure fairness and to avoid any difficulties of the sort that happened years ago when a teacher did not fit in with the ethos of a school. I would not like to see a provision that could produce unintended results.

An unregistered teacher is not necessarily an unqualified teacher. Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan got a lot off her chest in her contribution and we had a discussion earlier on this matter. There has to be some flexibility and I do not disagree but we must ensure that the child or the student is always central and teaching qualifications are important in setting standards. I accept this point but I ask that the flexibility be included.

The Minister will receive a report on school patronage in the near future. This issue is of interest in my area because of a new school to be sited very close to my home which is being discussed very robustly within the community. There is a number of options in which parents are expressing an interest, such as an all-Irish secondary school or a dual junior and senior cycle for the VEC Maynooth which is a very successful school. However, these options seem to be off the table before the decision is made, according to the information we have received, and this would be regrettable. If this were to be the case, the question of parental choice in determining the patronage of a school would be taken away. I will send the Minister a note on that point.

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